ARE WE LOOSING OUR RANKS?!?!?!?!?

Players with ranks are not normal players. They are builders who are trusted enough to have WE. Again, there is no need for a rank system. Believe me, I am all for the Trusted rank. However, there's no need for a rank system. I fail to see a legitimate reason in all of these responses.

I think you have your definition of selfish mixed up there, Dualley. Selfish means people who only care about themselves, like the people who want to keep their ranks just to feel special and apart from your playerbase. But, this debate isn't about selfishness. Ranks are not what makes the server fun, building is. The whole point of the server is to build, so that's why it's fun.

I do not only care about myself just because I want the rank system gone. I am considering the betterment of the servers and the moderators' time. i am thinking logically. There is no need for the rank system on Build since everyone already has WE.

 

The reason couldn't be more obvious. It's freedom of expression. It's to allow trusted members to operate without restrictions, giving them nearly unrestricted freedom of creativity. But it also filters out people who can't be trusted.

Uhh, what? You do realize that being for a trusted rank means you advocate a rank system? A rank system with two ranks is still a rank system sir. Your definition of a normal player is also very unclear. I thought we were talking about non-moderators, but, now it's new-joins.

I am not arguing that new-joins shouldn't have restricted worldedit, we have enough restrictions to prevent major problems. I am arguing that there are people who are trustworthy enough to go beyond restricted worldedit, and they should be allowed the freedom to build whatever they want, without the need of moderators to constantly teleport to them and build stuff for them. A moderators job of helping people includes more than just building people's stuff, like investigating griefs and sending in reports. That is what I meant when I said they have better things to do.

 

The rank system and the Trusted rank are different things. I don;t think you understand. The rank system implies multiple ranks with applications. The trusted rank is granted, not applied for. By normal player, I mean someone with no special permissions.

Brawl isn't restricted your freedom of expression rights with WE restrictions. The right refers more to expressing your opinion.

 

The admins don't have time to grant people ranks on an individual basis, the server is simply to large. Ranks have to be done by applications.

When I say freedom of expression, I really mean freedom of creativity, which falls under that umbrella. Sorry for being too vague. Worldedit restrictions hinder my ability to build what I want, is really what I'm trying to say here.

I don't quite understand you. You want an unranked system, where everyone is stuck at the same level. Everyone has the same restrictions. Players might be able to achieve a trusted rank, but it is handed out on an individual basis and asking for it will prevent you from getting it. As a result, not everyone who deserves the rank will get it.

Under a ranked system, everyone starts at the same level with restricted permissions and worldedit. But, everyone gets the opportunity to move up. Applications ensure that everyone has the chance to get a rank. Those who are trustworthy and have put effort into the server will move up. Creative has run under this system flawlessly for over a year. Can you point out what is wrong with this system?

 

I don't know if you understand the concept of the Trusted rank. It's really not something that's just given out. I'm going to call in some backup from @Rhoske to help explain it.

The issue with the ranked system is that since everyone already has WE, there's really nowhere to go. You can only have like one rank, because if you had more than one, they would be pretty pointless. And a side note, Build mods would grant this permission, not Admins.

 

The reason I don't understand this "trusted rank" because you won't explain it. If it's not given out, and you don't apply for it, how on earth do you get it? Is it automatic? Is it purchased? Is it aliens?

And yes, you can go somewhere. We've been talking about removing WorldEdit restrictions nearly the entire time. If you are a trustworthy person, and you get promoted, restrictions on the plugin are loosened.

 

The Trusted rank is granted by the moderators.

What I meant with not going anywhere is that if you have multiple ranks, the increase in permission would be so small.

• AdvBuilder(Equivilent): Loosened restrictions on //sphere
• WE 1: WE Block count restrictions decreased

Get what I mean? Sort of pointless to have multiple ranks.

 

Ok, so the trusted rank is given to players individually by moderators. This is not an efficient system, because there are hundreds of people who play creative. The moderators then have to go through all these people, observe them, and decide who is trustworthy. Additionally, people will be constantly begging for the rank, which will start the "if you ask for it, you don't get it" policy. This means only trustworthy people who the moderators have time for are going to get the rank. The quiet player building alone, doesn't get a chance. Now ask yourself if that's fair.

Applications lessen the moderators workload, and everyone gets heard. Moderators can go through everyone in one place. There is a reason why Brawl uses an application system.

Moving on, I think you are seriously underestimating the size of the WorldEdit plugin. Block edit limits, the brush tool, and schematics are all things that can be changed for different ranks. There was a whole thread concerning creative ranks pre-McPvp, mainly about changing the names of the ranks, but also about adding new ones. Suggestions included allowing the highest rank to host events, additional plugins and building tools, etc. The point is, permission increase is really not an issue.

 

The trusted rank is not something that's earned easily. You have to work hard to get it. Not many people will get it. Mainly people who build for the good of the server will get it, but whoever the moderators see fit will also get it.

I'm really done debating here, I have gone through all my points multiple times. I have still not been convinced in the least that a rank system is needed.

 

There's some serious irony going on in that first paragraph, but I'll leave it alone.

Good luck with your caps.

 

?

 

I hear you are a CTF regular

 

Oh, lol
Thanks c:

 

@Pegleg98

The Trusted rank will be given to active, mature, helpful and proficient members of the community. I can say with absolute certainty that there won't be any problems with handing Trusted ranks out on an individual basis since there are so few builders who fulfil all those qualities.

The big problem that came with the current creative rank system was the sense of entitlement from WEPros such as yourself. You should be building because you enjoy it, not because you want a dumb coloured name and accessibility to commands you should've had from the start.

"But, what makes Trusted so different?!" I hear you cry. Very good question: the thing is, Trusted can be handed out at any time, and that's great for new builders. Say, for example, someone from BlockWorksYT came along and had a look at Brawl Creative: they'd have a tiny plot with absolutely zero access to any tools that could make their life easier, and would have to spend a few days (minimum) grinding through the Ranks trying to prove that they're a good enough builder.

Now let's imagine they found Brawl's other creative server, Build: they'd be given a 512x512 world and WorldEdit with reasonable, understandable restrictions. Then they realise that, hey, there's a Trusted rank available! They have enough tools to prove that they're a good builder and be convinced to stick around on Build rather than other servers (seriously, I've looked, there aren't any servers that offer WE from the start). From there, proving that they're mature and learning the ins and outs of Build (shameless plug) is a piece of cake.

All this being said, I think that the only reasonable gripe people have with Build is that they may have more WE restrictions than they had on Brawl Creative. Fair enough, I hear ya. But what's also fair is that even those who are totally new to building are allowed the same creative freedom - as you so eloquently argued for - as anyone else. The restrictions, as I've said, are reasonable: we don't want inexperienced people lagging or crashing the server, and that's pretty much it. You'd be lying if you said you never experienced any WE-related crashed on Brawl Creative (I've personally experienced several), but I've never, in my entire time on MCPVP, seen Build crash from a normal player using WE improperly.

Also, believe it or not, in that time I never once heard a complaint about the 30 000 block restriction (the brush radii are a little small, I agree, but that's easily fixable). The average player never needs to edit more than that unless it's to flip a CTF map - which, like most other things, can be done in steps. I hear your argument about giant spheres too, but really? You're making biospheres as a WEPro? This is exactly why we don't want ranks - so that mediocre (no offense) builders can't act like they're more important than that BlockWorksYT guy who came in for a look around!

I've said it before and I'll say it again, there's no adequate reason to keep ranks in the format that they're in now. Stop feeling sentimental about Brawl Creative, come and have a look at Build with an open mind. Who knows, maybe you'll like it.

 

Edited. Sorry, I was shaking with furious rage and passion.

 

There are many people within this community that are capable of handling WorldEdit with few to no restrictions. I know many of these people, and I know there are more out there. Your system of handing out ranks on an individual basis is not only inefficient, but unfair. There are thousands of players on Brawl, do you not see the problem here? Like I said before, Brawl has a good reason for the application system. Everyone gets to be heard, and not just the people the mods happen to be around.

Now, before we go any further, let's get a few things straight. First, I build because I enjoy it, not for the cheap name tag. I applied for WEPro because I needed more building space. I won't argue with you if you're going to shove self-entitlement down my throat. Second, I am arguing for a rank system, not the one that presently exists on Brawl Creative. I do not think the current rank system is perfect, and I have expressed this before in rank applications that I believe other Brawlers have been too strict on. Third, neither plot size or quantity have anything to do with this--that's a topic for another day.

I've already said WorldEdit for new-joins is perfectly reasonable with sufficient restrictions, but trustworthy individuals should have the ability to have these restrictions removed. I believe we both agree on this, but your solution differs from mine. You have this idea of a single "trusted rank". This creates a two rank system, where the trusted rank is very difficult to achieve and there is nothing in-between. What makes a few in-between ranks important is that it allows people who are more trusted than new-joins, but maybe not quite trustworthy enough to have free reign, to have a little more creative freedom than those who just joined. The trade-off for more ranks is (obviously) that it will take longer to get through them. This system is only unfair to those who are lazy, and lazy players aren't going to build much anyway so there's no point in giving them higher ranks. The rank system also filters out individuals with malicous intent, because the system does not give them instant satisfaction and would rather make them work for it.

You are correct when you say Brawl Creative does infact crash as a result of human error using WorldEdit. But honestly, it doesn't happen as often as you make it sound. There are some days where it doesn't happen at all, and some where it happens two or three times. I've crashed it before based on a misunderstanding of a certain command did. It's called accidents, and they will happen. But the server restarts, no permanent damage is done to it, and we learn from our mistakes.

I don't make Biospheres, it was meant to be an example. But you know what really annoys me about what you just said? By saying that biosphere builds are mediocre, you are saying that different builds can be superior to others. Are fortresses better than skyscrapers? Are apples better than oranges? The answer is no--absolutely not. Biospheres may be a simple idea, but with a little creativity you could do something cool with them. It is not what you built that makes it good, it's the detail you put into it.

I won't be repeating myself anymore, but if you wish to repeat yourself I am willing to use quotes.

 

Even if Creative doesn't crash as often as said it still crashes. Restrictions are needed, I agree that there should be a trusted rank given to those who have shown that they are responsible but I do not want any non-staff to have no restrictions as the crashing of build hurts everybody playing.

Also, Brawl has thousands of people but very few play creative and even fewer are considered worthy of the trusted rank

 

I don't see threads everywhere about how crashing on creative is such a big problem. It doesn't destroy everyone's hopes and dreams of building or anything. They are only "hurt" in that they lost 5 minutes of building time. Nothing more than a minor setback. And not even a setback, more like a pause.

There are many people in the community that are mature and trustworthy enough to handle unrestricted* WorldEdit. I know this because there are dozens of people that play creative who have it and are not currently either
A. Attempting to bring down the server or B. Consistently making mistakes with it while not learning from them.

*By unrestricted I mean nearly unrestricted, and by that I mean nothing more than a block limit of 500k, or somewhere in the range.