Religion Debates and Discussions

He also pretty much tries to turn us all to his faith with the way he talks.

 

"Well, as long as you are without Jesus, you are dead and dying." Is that a threat

 

even if you are with jesus you are dead and dying because we are all equal in gods eyes

 

I'm just going to mention that everyone is down talking Gehenna for believing in God and yet he is really the only religious person who is consistently debating and talking it over with Atheists even though he is vastly in the minority here. It doesn't really matter what you believe in at this moment but that Gehenna has continuously been attacked, called names, and referred to condescendingly just because of his beliefs. Seriously a few of these posts border on cyber bullying with the amount of trash talk being thrown at him. You say that Atheists can be just as moral as Christians then prove it here.

 

Are we really talking about religion? This thread should be locked. Who cares if you believe in God or not. You have a right to an opinion and we should just keep it at that.

 

because gehenna posts weird religious stuff on his profile and tells us we are going to go to hell

 

I like to think I've been pretty civil in this thread. It's the internet, don't expect everyone to be perfectly nice. Plus, don't forget that atheists have been called immoral, wastes of life, and more. It's not like the Christians in this thread have been flawless, just that there are more atheists here to make mistakes. Admittedly, there's been more than I'd like to see, but thats in no way enough to imply that atheists are somehow worse as people. Also, has what gehennas been saying not counted as down talking? Saying that we're dead and dying for not sharing his beliefs, that were going to hell, that we're immoral, etc.?

Fortunately for us, it's in the off topic section, designed specifically for things that are off topic, like religion. Everyone can have their opinion, yes, but in a debate setting the whole idea is to try to change people's opinions. You wouldn't lock a thread about something related to the actual server based on an opinion, just because it's based on opinion. Why should this be treated differently?

 

I am going to disagree with you on this. I was not calling anyone out in particular but the general tone of this thread, nor was I trying to insult Atheists by calling them any of the above but mentioning the growing hostility. Also, I am only working with the info that I am seeing on this thread and what I am seeing is a lot of aggressive posts towards Gehenna from well... Atheists. I believe that Gehenna is trying to be blunt with what he says, and compared to the other posts on this thread, his are by far tamer. I am not even trying to take a side right now in this argument and I think I am only pointing out the obvious.

Generally, controversial topics aren't usually allowed to be discussed as feelings get hurt and angry comments are written, which is definitely different than a regular opinion that is usually posted on the forums.

 

I still don't think that the atheists in the thread have said, by percentage, any more offensive or demeaning things than the Christians. Tempers have flared, which isn't good, but the atheists are not the sole perpetrators. I don't think the atheists have been tamer, to be clear, I just think that the only difference between the insults hurled has been demeanor.
Again, I think I've been pretty civil here.

Then I think that's a pretty ridiculous rule. I think the insulting comments should be not allowed, rather than the topics.

 

No.
I think most of us have been pretty tolerant in trying to reason with Gehenna. The reason some of us are ticked off is-
1. Ignorance of almost everything we've talked about
2. Continues to use almost all of the evidence from one bible. History 101, don't make conclusions from only one source.
When I asked him whether he could provide another source instead of the bible, he decided that he wasn't bothered to find it and continued to reject everything we have put forward.
3. In about two pages back, he's swiftly reverted to a hostile tone in mentioning "we are going to hell" as a last ditch attempt. I find this pretty hostile. No one, no one wants to see an argument like this.

Anyway, I hope we can continue without seeing the word "hell' anymore.

 

Here's two questions I have now:
Are things moral because God says they're moral, or does God only tell us that they're moral?

And, on a related note, does claiming moral superiority over somebody not somewhat diminish the claim?

 

I'm sorry, but I don't care for the reasons you provided. It's no reason for people to get ticked off and result to insults. I am not saying that Gehenna hasn't said some things that are offensive but that he hasn't used language to force his points. Not saying that everyone does it but a few on here do.

Alright, don't get hung up on the fine points. All I am saying is people need to calm it down and stop thinking that using an asterisk makes their swearing okay or by thinking that insults will get people anywhere. And like I previously said while Gehenna has said things that are a bit offensive by nature the Atheists of the thread have by far used worse language. Again, I wasn't targeting you specifically but those who my original post was directed at.

Well it's a good thing you don't make the rules then

 

Language used doesn't equal force of an insult. I could say "women shouldn't be allowed to vote" and obviously that's wrong and offensive. I could also say "I ****ing wish you were ticklish," which is in essence a harmless insult, but the language used was worse.
Similarly, although to a more debatable extent, people on this thread have said gehenna is "****ing ignorant for ignoring evidence," which, while it is insulting, isn't the worst thing to be called. Gehenna has said that we are immoral because of our atheism. Id argue that being called fundamentally immoral is worse than being called ignorant, but that's debatable. My point is that both sides have used insults to push their ideas, so neither one is solely at fault.
I could also argue that your passive-aggressive response to my disagreement with the rules is insulting as well, because it implies that I'm somehow less capable of opinion-based judgement. I won't argue that, because I don't believe it and I can give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you didn't mean it as an insult, but it shows how language really doesn't have a lot to do with the point being made.
I wouldn't say that things gehenna has said have been only "a bit insulting." Debatable they've been more insulting than a lot of what we've said.

Also, can you explain a no more why you don't think his points were valid? I mean, everything he said was accurate.

 

I never really questioned their validity only that they didn't matter with what my point was. _EnderFire said, "The reason some of us are ticked off is-" It doesn't matter why they were ticked off just that they lashed out in some way by use of language or tone. Maybe his points were valid maybe not but my point was that we need to behave like mature people.

Oh and that's an opinion which can't be wrong because it's a person's opinion which means it will remain correct in that person's mind until they change that opinion.

 

Maybe wrong was the wrong word, but it's definitely more insulting than saying you wish someone were ticklish. My point remains, though, which is that the language used doesn't equate to the severity of the insult.

I'd also like to point out that the claim that atheists have been more insulting because of their inferior moral status ignores the alternate possibilities (yes, I know you never said that atheists are less moral, but you were pushing the point that because the atheists have been more insulting, we haven't proven our moral equality. This is essentially the same thing, and it at least is subject to the same criticism as the former claim).
Other possibilities include:

• Maybe atheists are, by nature, more thick-skinned than Christians, and may not realize that not everyone can take as much insulting as them. I've played with Usp & edin before, and I know that if anything here were said to them, they'd take it in stride and wouldn't really be too affected by it.
• Maybe atheists don't see offensive language as offensive, and don't consider censoring themselves because they don't see that others may get offended by it (personally, I can sometimes be guilty of this.)

You see, none of these explanations are logical, because there's no inherent difference between Christians and atheists, beyond their belief set and no proof of cause.

Also, this thread alone isn't enough to show that atheists as a whole can't be as moral as Christians. It's handpicking a few examples of atheists and applying them to the whole of the group.
And yes, I understand that you're not trying to say that atheists as a whole are less moral than Christians or anything. I'm just putting down the claim before it rises.

 

And that's your opinion. Look, I am not here to continue debating but to warn against the growing hostile nature. That's all.

 

If opinion is all-ending, then couldn't one argue that nothing anyone has said has been inflammatory at all?
I agree that we need to tone it down, but I'd like to contest this use of the word "opinion" to nullify a point. It sort of invalidates the times when using it to actually debate is useful by oversaturating its use, and I'd like to keep this thread as open to debate as possible.

 

"Keep offensive language (cursing) to a minimum.
Do not bypass or attempt to bypass any word filters." I don't think the Brawl forum rules should be up for debate.

 

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