Should instakills be kept?

The one-shot-kills seem fine in my opinion.

• Archers can sometimes be pesky, but how else can they get kills?
• Pyro is balanced enough. Shooting a player directly and then hitting them with the axe gives enough time for players to kill the Pyro.
• Assassin seems relatively balanced too. It takes time to kill a player with it.

 

#debate

 

I don't think you've ever dealt with a pyro in-game. They can use flint and steel or just hold the bow on defense so you essentially have no window of time.

 

The question is, how would you make make the instakills class not be able to decimate noobs easily? If you make an instakills balanced game, the instakills would have to be very difficult to pull off, but then there would be no point to keeping the instakill. A balanced game would be noob friendly, but tthe instakills would have to be radically changed so that it takes immense effort for the output to be useful.

 

And that is why you send players that are Ninjas after the Pyros. There is plenty of time to attack.
I took out at least 5 today.

 

Ninja is currently broken and glitched in the beta version, so its not a surprise you managed to kill them. Also, keep in mind, ninja is one of the two counters to pyro. Pyro kills everything else with ease.

 

and free players?

 

I understand now, a Ninja would be sneaking up on a Pyro easily while a Heavy couldn't be invisible like the Ninja.
Oh, and what's glitched with Ninja?

 

well, you can look at it that way but you can also change the way other classes deal with instakill. it would be nice to see a game mechanic that works as a counter to archer/pyro as opposed to hiding behind a wall or standing in water.

i do agree though, it would be hard to balance instakill but if there is a way to achieve balance then i'd choose balanced instakills over balanced non instakills.

 

Invisibility bugs from what I've heard.

 

I voted to get rid of instakills. However, in a balanced gamemode I guess instakills wouldn't be a problem. But, I don't think instakills can ever be balanced :/

Reasons why:

- Archer: Very easy to play, no counter except archer. No fun to play against.
- Assassin: Ping based, can hide around corners to instakill without giving players a chance, no fun to play against. Also one of the easiest classes to play.
- Pyro: Really OP, and very easy to play. Pyro really only has one counter (assuming damage values are fixed).

@18kss I don't think you understand how pyro works lol....

 

How would you go about balancing insta-kills with CTF exactly? I just don't see that working. You could make everyone have an insta-kill, but that's just stupid. You could make direct class counters to insta-kills like medic and pyro, but that would result in not much gameplay or pvp skill at all. You could make more counters like blocking, but there really isn't much in minecraft besides that.

It's much easier to just remove insta-kills and rework those classes. We have 3 insta-kills (not counting dwarf). We have 10 other non-instakill classes. To balance insta-kills you would have to change all of those classes. I am aware you would have to change classes to balance without insta-kills as well, but not as much as with insta-kills, You would basically have to change the entire gamemode to do that with insta-kills.

Also, I don't see how insta-kills are noob friendly. If someone joins the game and immediately gets rekt in one shot, they are going to get really discouraged, really fast, and then quit. If someone joins and still gets rekt, but manages to land a few hits, they might keep on going and play more. In addition, with insta-kills, pvp skills doesn't really transfer. Sure, you have to hit them once, but that really isn't hard. Without insta-kills, it's easier for people with a pvp background, which is the target audience of the gamemode anyway, to get integrated into the game.

 

I JUST bought assassin...

 

@obikenobi21 I think instakills are noob friendly because they are super easy to do, but I don't really understand that and agree with every you just said ^^

 

Insta-kills in my opinion should be kept. Like what Matt said, they keep the game fast-paced and challenging. I honestly think it's fun when you have to find ways to get around these classes. Sure, it can get annoying but that's just my opinion.

 

Keep in mind, they aren't asking to remove instakills now. Classes like assassin would be reworked so they have something cool like a short range teleport or a backstab feature. Anything really.

 

Just because you remove instakills doesn't take away from the faced pace factor. Ninja, chemist and assassin all have very fast gameplay. I'm assuming assassin would have fast gameplay post-rework.

But CTF won't be slow paced without instakills. Fights outside of chemist/heavy fights are really quick, and hopefully chemist can be fixed soon...

 

Call me biased, but if instakills remain and balance ensues, then I don't think there's a reason to remove them. Instakills would be noob friendly, because in a balanced game, no classes would have as high an advantage as the current instakill classes. Even noobs would have a decent chance at killing them.

However, balancing instakills sounds difficult to execute, so I'd be fine either way.

 

I can honestly see pyro becoming a non-insta class. I think the way newer players use it in midfield is terrible and a main factor in the loss of other newer players. If, for example, pyro dealt 3.5 hearts of true damage, with an additional buff (either mobility, or some was to make setting on fire easier), pyro would keep it's effective counter against classes such as heavy and soldier, whilst losing much of an advantage against classes like chemist and necro, who have higher true damage health pools (lots of heal pots, 6 steaks). I could see this being implemented in to the game and have no issue, if soldier was changed also.

Personally I think that instakills are the essence of assassin and archer. Whilst being annoying, without instakills archer would become far less able to kill, and assassin would lose much of the map knowledge needed to be effective, due to the element of surprise that is lost when taking longer to kill opponents.

 

If a thread like this was made a year ago... I would've voted yes in a heartbeat. But now, I strongly encourage for InstaKills to be kept... it adds a completely new level to the game besides just steak and pots and PvP.