Should instakills be kept?

Okay, firstly enough about the "instakill takes no skill". There is obviously just as much skill involved in an instakill class, although sometimes not in the most obvious ways. I personally have found myself reaching my personal skill cap of ninja, heavy, soldier relatively quickly, but pyro offers me new challenges every day.

I can understand why instakills are hated. They essentially can break down the structure of a team in an instant, and this is what I feel brings the excitement to CTF. Instakills force players to step out of a tunnel vision comfort zone and notice their surroundings for dangerous threats. If these threats were removed, and the biggest threat became a buffed heavy on recov, I feel as if the game would become stale and lose the cutting edge that keeps players playing.

Dont assume that people play instakill because they cannot PvP. Most CTF mains have at least some skill in PvP. Its simply that some people prefer to use maps to their advantage and outwit their opponent rather than beat them using pure fighting skill.

 

I love this sentence, it makes no sense.

Anyways.

As much as I love the class, I shouldn't be able to pick up archer after not playing in nearly a half year and near- singlehandedly prevent an entire team from leaving a few blocks past their spawn.

Whether or not it's fair in some situations has to be considered in the same light as the the situations when it can break games.

 

Thanks you for saying what I mean to.

I also might need to mention that from my experience, I can reach a pretty high skill cap until someone decides to start using Pyro because of me. Way to reward getting good at something1!

 

Hmm I should have thought that phrase through xD

That is indeed a very good point and one of the main reasons why instakills can be a bad idea. It can be hard to balance a game where at one end there are very experienced players trying to use instakills to outsmart the other team and help their team, but on the other end there are players just trying to rack up kills. I would certainly support any change to prevent classes being used in cheap/killwhoring ways

 

Thats an example of a flawed countering system. I remember at one point I decided to pyro cap for a while because I was bored, and it worked okay, but the second there was an assassin defending there was nothing I could do.

 

My point exactly. You can't really avoid that with instakills being in the game unless you make everything die so quickly that instakills are hardly relevant.



Today is the first time I'm really even playing MC in a month. One on top was after playing Assassin for the first time in several months and on the bottom is for Pyro. Both classes I picked off defenders or threats when playing offense and played defense. This seems pretty solid for things I almost never touch in a game I haven't touched in a while.
If that doesn't show that the classes don't need as much skill, and I should be having like 2490503485 kills or something, it still shows the high standard for those classes because they're so good.

I'm sure the 44 people killed in this enjoyed it all and felt like they stood a chance.

 

@Tysonyoshi when you can't effectively take out the offense, 50-60 people don't enjoy a never ending stalemate.

 

omf this argument
Screw you guys imma go hstone

 

I believe instakills should be removed or the flag timer (to pick it up) should be removed because when someone can insta-kill, it makes it almost impossible to get the flag if they are guarding it.

the thread was kinda too long and didn't read but if anyone is complaining about how without instakills its not balanced or w/e, I've played other CTF kit servers where they did not have instakills and it wasn't unbalanced.

 

And when you die instantly, 100% of people dun enjoy the game.

 

It's sad that so many biased players actually want instakills. INstakills are the reason why CTF is broken.

1. Have you ever played against a flag-camping pyro?

1. By SHOOTING THEIR BOW!!!!
2. What if they are flag-camping or start flint-spamming?
3. Assassin's counter is ping-based.

Archer has no counter. Assassin's counter is ping-based. Not everyone wants to type /medic every time a pyro is kill-farming at the flag, and not every map has water in it.

Learn what ping is.

Learn what ping is.

Fighting fire with fire just fuels the flames.

 

In my experience, instakills force players to actually take in their surroundings and play at a higher level. Instakills can be annoying but playing incredibly stalemate games can be just as annoying. As Baker stated before, instakills keeps the game fast paced and on it's toes as the flag carrier could die at any moment. Instakills can help prevent one team from staying on top for too long and remove the unwanted effort of draining a chemist or a buffed heavy all the way down to 0 health. Having just one team flooring the other isn't as fun at all.

 

You assume that stalemates will happen without insta-kills, when it really could go either way. It really depends on the rework put in place. There is also no guarantee that the game will suddenly be not fast paced without insta-kill. Do you not find ninja fast-paced? Right, but chemist and buffed heavy need to be reworked as well. Slapping an insta-kill to fix an OP think doesn't actually address the problem at hand. And insta-kills don't prevent one team dominating another. If you took a team of pr0s, against a team of noobs, and only allowed the noobs to play insta-kills, the pros would still win, and it wouldn't even be close.

 

1. Even heard of teamwork?

1. Doesn't sound you like you play archer much...
2. Get someone in the to distract them or just rush in with a group. There is no I in team

"Archer has no counter" <Ninja> wat

 

Which of my points are you responding to? I don't play archer that much because I don't abuse classes.

 

I'm more curious how you missed that the point is that it's a hypothetical situation where the game is balanced either way.

Also, are you sure you're not biased in claiming that instakills are breaking the game? How could you know the game would be broken if it was balanced hypothetically?

Also, I don't think I've ever seen a post where you weren't salty. Y'allright?

 

But if you take a game with pros up some and pros up nothing, there is still a comeback potential, I wasn't talking about teams of completely different levels of skill. Instakills (in the right hands) help level the playing field.

I'm not saying "every class" should have a instakill or that there isn't a problem with the ones here now but trying to recover on a buffed heavy with about 5 medics behind them will be incredibly easier with a headshot.

 

A lot of players don't want the instakills to change though, which is why I said that. It's impossible to balance instakills. Even if they were nerfed, they would still remove teamwork.

1. Exactly. Instakills remove the need for teamwork. One player shouldn't be able to kill an entire flag room.]
1. Fighting fire with fire just fuels the flames.
2. Look above

 

If anything, instakills are good at creating teamwork rather than diffusing it. Having someone bait out the flag outside of a closed room while an archer is ready to fire sounds like teamwork to me. Also

1: Hitting someone with fire spell so a pyro can get the kill
2: Clearing a flag room with assassin so the soldier can steal
3: Headshotting an offense to swindel their numbers and have your defense take the rest out

There are more examples but you get the point

 

How do they "create teamwork"? A single class can kill an entire flagroom ALONE. That is not teamwork.