Should instakills be kept?

Wow the post system trolled me....
Anyway, archer does have a counter, Elf. Although it takes skill to kill an archer, it's possible.
Also, Elf counters pyro

 

^^ elf can counter a group of archers a lot more than most people realise. When elf first came out, the newer archers started dying a lot, and the more experienced archers had to watch who they were firing at.

 

I get that its Soldier/Heavy/Chemist. But if you have a 5 man defense you should be able to take one 1 guy out on most maps. If you can't 5v1 someone then you got outplayed.

Only one of them is free, and I thought it was established that being able to type a class command into the chat doesn't reflect any skill nor does forcing yourself to change up your game or change classes because of one Pyro that's just sitting there is good.

Archer is instakill too and it depends on the map. Elf is too weak around the board for anything else. Engineer is Engineer, and I think people would rather avoid that hate which still comes with playing Engineer at times.

Encouraging the use of a hard counter system like this also encourages targeting.

 

Sorry, this may be out of context. Im not saying that people should be forced to switch to adapt to pyro, merely saying that it does in fact have some counters. I believe someone said earlier that pyro was uncounterable besides medic. This wasn't directed at you.

 

1. Pyro's armor wouldn't handle 9182409128308129038 hits, hell it can't even handle a chemist with strength II and Asssassin's instakill can be counter all by pressing the block button. Those classes can kill in one hit but they are fragile enough so that they can be killed in less than 4. The time it takes to press the mouse button 4 times is like 3-5 secs. A pro can still destroy a assassin and a pyro with ease.
2. Stalemates would exist without instakills.
3. You can't honestly tell me the only reason your team lost was because of instakills, if so, good. If your team was unable to make the adjustments to deal with a fragile class (or classes), good on the other team for winning. Instakill classes aren't invincible, stop treating them as such.
4. That's great and I hope that comes to be
5. A one man defense that can be countered by a two or one man offense. I have seen pyro defenses get destroyed before, it isn't too hard.

 

- And the only classes that can do that kind of damage (barring against Assassin), are premium or need the Chemist buffs from a premium class. Guess I have to buy classes to win now.
Blocking isn't some magic solution to ending all Assassin problems. It's hardly relevant unless you're paranoid as **** playing in F5 if they come up behind, like they always do.
Just because a pro can beat it doesn't mean it's balanced.
- My team doesn't get fed credit cards, so we were unable to make the adjustments the win. Good on the game being Pay2Win. I never said they were invincible either, there's really just isn't that many big drawbacks to using instakill aside from being weaker to Ninja.
- How to destroy Pyro defense. Switch classes. Get someone to bait or kill the Pyro for you. Hope that the Pyro is just that bad. I only think the second one is good for the game, but Medic takes a bit of time and anything else is just risky.

 

But the classes that can kill in one hit still kill in one hit.

One hit>4 hits

1 second>3-5 seconds.

It doesn't matter how fragile these classes are if the opponent gets destroyed anyway.

 

fun and fair

pretty much sums up why I dont record CTF anymore with the amount of BS like that

 

1: I don't indorse pay2win and its not like you play vanilla without the help from premium classes either. I never endorsed pay2win in my argument, I endorse counter play, something that seems to be lost on this server
2: Well that's too bad. An assassin is suppose to do that, what you want? For an assassin to get some diamond armor and fight you "like a man"? Assassin was built to be hit and run (doesn't mean some abuse it). If you can't handle having to change your playstyle in order to deal with a threat, that's not my problem. Assassins irl and in the game act the same way.
3. See number one.and I very much doubt your entire class was free classes only. This isn't "free vs pay2win", if you think premium classes are a problem, there is another thread for that.
4: Kthx

"if". Like I said before, a pyro doesn't get every single fire kill like a archer doesn't get every single headshot. Since there doesn't exist a archer with a 128-0 ks, its safe to you guys give too much credit to the people playing these classes.

 

Wat do you mean if? If the insta-killer is so b4d they don't land one hit? I don't see your point here. You're arguing that 4 hits to destroy an instakiller trumps the one hit they take to kill you?

 

Pyro requires the enemy to be lit on fire, archer require a bit of distance and good aim and assassin is built around evasion and stealth and the fact that if it misses, it could die just as easy as it kills. None of classes can instakill without some condition or risk.

For the third time, you forgot that people play this classes, human beings and that human beings aren't perfect. Yeah it takes only 4 hits to 1 but at the speed at which those hits come out, it's HARDLY a real difference. You forget how fast a sword in Minecraft swings (or that you don't have to be able to kill everything in way) again this is ctf.

Instakillers can kill fast but also die fast. If you have "one hit ko" in your head all day, you never realize that the glass cannon is made out of glass.

 

And you dun freakin realize that the cannon is still a cannon. The people getting these 4 hits aren't perfect either. They could miss too, and one skrew up by them and gg.

And wat da faq do you mean there is no difference? I'm pretty sure 1 hit comes out way faster then 4, but then again, common sense doesn't apply here.

And the people non insta-killing kill slower and die faster. The odds are stacked pretty heavily in the insta-kilers favor.

For pyro, lighting people on fire is extremely easy, just spam flint and steel or use your bow. In addition, 5 steak goes a long way, 20 extra hearts. Archer, well, there is no risk for the archer besides missing and maybe them noticing you. Assassin has it's own problems :/, either too good or really bad.

 

1: Its a matter of perspective I guess. A can do attitude trumps a can't do one.
2: Because 2 more seconds is SUCH an important difference. You're right about the common sense thing, your post was a prime example.
3: Jumping into a puddle of water or straight up avoiding a pyro is easy too. But again, CTF is all about the kills and not the flag... Also ninjas. Ninjas go after archers like moths to a flame, so do soldiers, heavys and any other class able to kill archer at close range (which is a large portion of the cast). Same for assassins.

 

2 step instakills are balanced imo. Assassin is the really the only non-balanced instakill

 

It's pretty obvious that I'm going to say that instakills should be kept. It would be nice if they were more balanced than they are now however.

 

I've never had a problem with insta-kills in-game (probably because I'm an archer) but I don't think the classes themselves are the problem with ctf. Let's debug ctf FIRST, then we can worry about little jimmy being upset about getting headshotted.

 

Remove the Archer insta, its so freaking annoying.

 

So this just backs up my argument that people that use Instakills are actually bad PvPers. Literally. If you actually know how to PvP, you can dodge some and hit back. Instakills are very hard to dodge since 1 hit and you're screwed I've only dodged them a few times.

You forget that there aren't puddles of water everywhere on the map. "All about the kills not the flag" It's Capture the Flag, not Capture the Kills. I'd suggest if you like to get kills to play on a Kit PvP server since that's where kills really matter.

There's going to be someone on here like "CTF in minecraft isn't like CTF IRL"
But Capture the Flag is one of my favorite games in real life, and I'm pretty sure getting the flag is a bit more important than attacking people trying to get the flag. If no one's getting the flag, the game will end in a draw.
Same with playing CTF online. If you're too busy trying to kill random people from the other team, no one is going to win if no one goes for the flag. What's so different about it then than other PvP servers if its only about the kills and not the flag.

 

1. Just be because someone uses an instakill class doesn't mean they are a bad pvper. It may be they want to use that class.

2. I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic...

 

I guess dat works.

So you think it isn't? In my experience, usually the one that kills faster kills first, but y'know, maybe every class but insta-kills are the exception!!!

Some maps have no puddles, and you can't avoid them all the time, because as you said, CTF is about capping, so if a pyro's guarding the flag, what do you do, avoid them?!?! Let's run away, because that'll do cap the flag!!! Yes they do, at close range, but at long range noting except Elf has a good counter. Assassin goes both ways tbh, assassins kill everything, everything kills assassins....like I said, assassin has it's own problems, I dun think it's OP nor UP, just a broken concept.