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Idea Pyro Rework

Discussion in 'Capture the Flag' started by Sir_Inge, Jul 26, 2015.

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  1. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Armor:

    Full leather armor (Dyed)

    Inventory:

    Pyro Axe (Diamond axe)
    Pyro Steak (4)
    Pyro Bow
    Pyro Fireballs (3, regenerate 1 every 3 seconds)
    Pyro Arrow (3, regenerates 1 every 3 seconds)

    Abilities:

    Pyro Axe:
    Deals 4 hearts of true damage to targets on fire. Any sequential hits within 3 seconds of each other deal 0.5 hearts more per hit. (2 hits: 4.5 hearts of damage, 8.5 if no steak, 3 hits 5 hearts of damage, 13.5 if no steak)

    Pyro Steak: Heals 4 hearts

    Pyro Bow: Any arrow discharged INCLUDING those not at full draw create a 3x3 explosion radius and set targets on fire. The explosion does 0 damage.
    The bow overheats if at full draw for more than 1 second and explodes in the pyro's hand, setting them on fire.

    Pyro Fireballs:
    Sets a 2x2 area on fire, which is extinguished after 1 second.

    Tweaks to other classes:
    Soldier cannot wall climb when on fire
    Medic is no longer immune to fire
    Elf's water spell prevents anyone or anything from being lit on fire in the radius for 3 seconds after it lands.

    Tried to make it a defensive but not campy pyro.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    #1 Sir_Inge, Jul 26, 2015
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2015
  2. furtles

    furtles Well-Known Member

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    I think having steaks that heal 4.5 hearts is confusing. 4 steaks of 4.5 hearts and 5 steaks of 4 hearts provide the same amount of health. I get that what you are trying to do here, but it's just confusing and won't help pyro out that much.

    Edit: More feedback

    I also don't like how soldier loses it's ability to wallclimb when on fire. I think a rework to soldier would be a fix more suited to this rework.
     
  3. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Wait, I thought steaks usually healed 4.5. Is it only 4?
     
  4. furtles

    furtles Well-Known Member

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    It is only 4 hearts as far as I know.
     
  5. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, changed.
     
  6. TOM_SAYS

    TOM_SAYS Active Member

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    This still makes it op and campcentered, and even removes the chance for a soldier to cap. It's meant that defensive classes (I assume you still insist that pyro should be mainly defensive) make it hard to cap, but not impossible.

    Now I agree with the true damage concept. I edited my pyro, and pyroblade now deals 4 hearts of true damage, so it's still a counter against heavy-armoured classes. But the problem with your rework is, that's still based on the old pyromaniac design. The old pyro only works for instakills. A pyro like this is easily potspammed by a chemist. It also seems equally boring to me to blow people up and hit them 3-5 times instead of instakilling them. This does not work in pvp.
     
  7. pandanielxd

    pandanielxd its panda daniel

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    <Tom>: It's bad now look at mine
     
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  8. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    This class is NOT camp centered. In fact, this class is now a back/mid field class. And it doesn't shut down soldier. It prevents an offense from stealing up and down.
     
    #8 Sir_Inge, Jul 26, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 26, 2015
  9. StrikerSly

    StrikerSly Well-Known Member

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    I don't like how medics/soldiers have their abilities nerfed. They're fine the way they are, but it's the pyro rework that we are talking about, not other classes.
     
  10. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Striker, pyro, chemist, medic, and soldier are all very closely linked to each other because they all counter each other (unfairly in many cases). Pyro is the only thing that stops soldier and chemist from dominating, but while doing so, effectively 100% shuts down the rest of the offense. If pyro is nerfed, chemist and soldier MUST follow. Medic is the only hard counter to pyro (and it really shouldn't be capping, it's a support class like engineer) so if pyro is nerfed, that counter is no longer needed.
     
  11. TechDweebGaming

    TechDweebGaming Active Member

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    Again with removing instakill... As Tom said, having to first draw back a bow fully then hit 3-5 times takes WAY to much time and makes it nearly impossible to get kills with pyro, though the limit on being able to hold a fully primed bow is awesome :smile:
     
  12. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Actually, the bow doesn't have to be fully drawn, and hopefully you won't be the only one on defense. I know that this damage would really hurt a chemist, and with a ninja on recovery... Well, you're dead.
     
  13. StrikerSly

    StrikerSly Well-Known Member

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    I don't know about you, but soldiers are pretty easy to kill. Especially as an archer.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. TOM_SAYS

    TOM_SAYS Active Member

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    How am I closeminded? It's no rocketscience to see that this "pyro" is easily killed by a decent chemist and is way to OP against incoming soldiers. This class could never survive in the mid/backfield! Drawing your bow, even for a smal shortrange explosion takes time and is killed by a chemist, ninja, mage or heavy before the pyro ever had the chance to give a second hit with the axe. Fact is, your pyro is still campcentered and unable to pvp with.
     
  15. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    This is why chemist needs a nerf, and it's not OP against soldiers. I believe I already explained why.

    Soldiers are easy enough to kill, sure, but that don't compensate for the fact that they can fly away before they take, like, any damage. And archer isn't reliable for a recov unless it's on your side of the map. When soldiers get to their side, they are often joined by a medic, and they become practically unkillable.
     
  16. TOM_SAYS

    TOM_SAYS Active Member

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    " And it doesn't shut down soldier. It prevents an offense from stealing up and down." So I'm supposed to take this as a valid argument? It prevents soldiers to escape, so it will die a quick painful death. It's obviously way to op against soldier.

    Now I agree that soldier needs a small nerf but why chemist? It should stay the main dominator on closerange damage in my opinion, which can be balanced to give it weakness against all kinds of ranged attacks.
     
  17. lasertagfighter

    lasertagfighter Well-Known Member

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    It makes sense: you play as chemist, ninja and sometimes Mage.
     
  18. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Make that Mage, Chemist, sometimes Ninja, and occasionally Medic. Yeah, sorry about that.

    It does enough damage to weaken soldier so that it can't run willy nilly but not enough to doom it. And chemist needs a nerf because OMG that health pool is equivalent to like 20 steaks. It takes 2+ ninjas and a heavy to bring me down as chemi and I can't imagine what it takes to bring down @Cliff_92.
     
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  19. TOM_SAYS

    TOM_SAYS Active Member

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    Really? Explosion damage + damage tick by fire + the pyro and all the other defenders + situational confusion = death! There is no way a soldier can get out alive of that flagroom.

    Chemist is has weak armour and if weak against ranged, so the healthpool is fair in my opinion. Besides, chemist isn't a cap class per se. It's a closerange combat class.
     
  20. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    I'm going to pull out of this argument. I've decided that it's best not to participate further.
     
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