CTF is not Kohi

Let's just face it, CTF will never be perfectly balanced. That isn't because the folks in charge aren't trying their hardest, though. It is because no one actually knows how CTF is supposed to be balanced.

CTF is such a complex game with so many variables. The only counter that is guaranteed to work 100% of the time is the counter between pyro and medic. A ninja can only sometimes counter a pyro or a chemist.

It is almost pointless to try to make CTF balanced. In the end, you are only really upsetting some people while pleasing others.

 

It doesnt require skill to tap tap someone with a sword. assassin, ninja, pyro, etc used to take more skill to take down. Flag carriers also.

Now, i understand they had to nerf some stuff like enginers ability to block off entrances, etc. But come on, its requiring less and less teamwork to take someone out, in a team based game.

Pyros nerf really makes flint and bow useless, since pyros frenzy is 360 degrees 3-5 block area hit for half damage.

I could go into more description but im tired.

 

Just because CTF is more than PvP doesn't make the PvP matter even less. Yes, the objective behind CTF is the solid core of the gamemode. But the way that is executed is pvp. So yes, pvp matters quite a lot.

It could 2 shot pyro, yur right. But pyro one shot ninja, so steak+hit=dead.

Yes ninja could counter chemist, but chemist was still OP as f0k. I'm actually killing more chemists then I ever did back then, but that's probably due to me getting better, as well as me switching from a trackpad and arrow keys to a mouse and wasd.

You are right, the unkillable chemists were undoubtedly skilled. But skill should not allow you to 1 v 5 a flagroom and entire recovery team, kill them all, and then cap. While that could happen, that should really only be the case if you are extremely good, and they are really bad, which was not always the case.

Oh, allright. Wait da faq? In that context that statement makes no sense.
"People say offense was too hard? -soldier didn't have that wall-climb limit"

Are you saying offense is harder now? Because otherwise I have no idea what point that statement makes.

The problem does persist, but I find it persisting a lot less. Currently I find the main problems in CTF to be archer and medic, which shortens my list considerable. (yes, dwarf is a problem, but as a recov player I dun run into one often xd).

??? I don't understand that statement at all. I find pyro pretty find right now, because medic isn't needed to counter it. A good soldier can knock the pyro back, tank a hit or 2, then run away. You don't need to do anything to pyro if you nerf medic.


And I'm going to reply to yur reply to Yoshi xddd

Really? Pyro being a defense-only class got it an absurdly high kdr. Since it was defense based, it didn't usually die, and got insanely high kill-streaks because of it's insta-kill. So it's kdr being yoshi's highest makes complete sense. And even if he did go offensive pyro, pyro countered every class but medic and itself, so his kdr being super high is also completely plausible. It's just not many people did it, so the effectiveness is hard to judge.

 

I don't find defensive Pyro to be entertaining to play at all, so I just play offense and put in work that I could with Heavy in much less time with a better KDR most of the time. It's perfectly viable, maybe not for directly attacking flagrooms, but still viable. Flint and Steel isn't that hard to use either.

EDIT: Scratch that part about flagrooms, frenzy mode is busted lmao.

 

I'm just not gonna take any sides in this argument so I can avoid getting myself into too much controversy. I will, though, say a few things:
"In hindsight - why am I even requesting changes when I know it won't happen lmao" This is the first time in a while someone has actually questioned why they're proposing ideas in the first place. Unfortunately, you're right though. These things will never get implemented.

Now this guy. THIS guy has the right mindset.

 

I would like to remind you guys hallo didn't code all of this, but still thank him for his part in hosting (,:

 

Ya I know, 5ive, Kirby and Avenged helped too. Maybe others, idk

 

U forgot Dwarf getting destroyed by Mage

 

Omg I forgot dwarf! How could anyone ever forget dwarf? xDDD

Yo but seriously I guess there are two counters in CTF. Perfect balance.

 

Wow I never realized this at all, all the kit changes have been pvp oriented, and I think that's really important to note. I think any adjustments or reverses will be received poorly and shouldn't be attempted anytime soon, but still I am glad you made this post.

 

yea i feel like ctf was fine how it was before mcpvp took over

 

Agreed @Plautius.

CTF doesn't need a nerf. It needs a rework.

 

This post is everything
Preach this shiet till people realise nerfs only will ruin this goddamn game
I mean, not like it isnt ruined since the nerfs on pyro and chemist, but that's none of my business

CTF was better back when people didnt cry about nerfing all the classes, because in reality, Things are much more fun when a game is sudden and a quick burst of movement and doesnt take long to play. One reason why I played ctf back when I had a terrible pc was because I still had fun with the instakill classes. Now it's exactly what you're saying has become

IF you disagree with this post, and I am not being insecure or arrogant, you are denying that CTF has regressed from the thing it really was. Why don't more players come to play CTF? Because it's more skill orientated. People liked the quick games ctf were, now its literally pvp with dumb items instead of the fun gamemode it once was.

inb4 the brawl kissups defending CTF staff's dumb nerfs

Becoming more skill, which decreases the amount of players leading to decreasing revenue,
or becoming more of a fun gamemode and increase in players which subsequently leads to increase in revenue?
Pfft obviously less revenue is the logic of ctf 2016

 

THANK YOU
the game should be more balanced, not that it should be nerfed. There's a massive difference between the two things. One assumes you're going to make everything weaker. The other assumes that things are fair. Nerfing everything will make the game boring (hence why I wasn't as bothered as I thought I'd be by the pyro nerf, it's still very effective when played right). That doesn't mean we should make everything totally weak! As long as it's fair it shouldn't matter how powerful each class is. (hell if every single class had instakill potential and was balanced, then it would still be fine for everyone). Nerfing is a tool of balance, it's not the only way to do so

 

I don't see how more skill leads to less players. If that was the case many skill based gamemodes would be completely dead, but that's definitely not the case. If you can't have fun without an insta-kill, you're playing the wrong game.

 

i don't really have a stance in this debate since i find both sides interesting but you can't deny CTF had way way way more players when everything was OP. you can't assume correlation = causation but the difference is very significant...

"minecraft is declining in popularity as a whole so CTF has less players"



lol

 

Eh I sort of agree to an extent that some classes should be easier to use than others, and that some parts of CTF should not require to be extraordinarily PvP orientated. CTF has always been a welcoming game to people who don't like to or are just not that good at core PvP. If you want to defend yet don't want to/suck at PvP you've got pyro, medic, Assassin. If you want to cap (note: capping will and always will be the hardest role in the game so therefor it should require PvP skill no matter what) there is medic offense support. Just like killing? Archer and mage are the perfect classes for it. So that's my two cents on it and I agree that classes should be nerfed less and allow a very loosely PvP orientated aspect to the game.

 

CTF could be balanced whether with OP classes/insta-kills (the more fun & noob friendly option where everybody is OP by default) or not. But in the direction we're headed (weaker & equal classes by default, with skilled players outshining the rest), archer (and of course dwarf) need to get nerfed and necro needs its awaited buff.

 

Mineplex, Hypixel
It's more fun than skill in those servers and coincidenetally they're the most popular servers in MC. More people prefer fun gamemodes over skill gamemodes, and those servers' popularity proves that

What feels more rewarding? Being able to escape a flagroom full of pyros who could instakill and capture the flag or just survive a few hits with a diamond axe whilst on fire? It surely feels better getting caught on fire and escaping the flagroom from multiple pyros who can instakill if you ask me.

In my opinion people who complained about the instakills are those who want to make ctf more easier for the better players to dominate the rest and less interesting for newcomers. May i also remind you that not everyone in MC has a stable framerate (yes people who have crappy pcs for minecraft still exist) to play the game with classes like heavy, however they could still have had fun if they played pyro or archer because they simply involved less skill and can still play well with them. (at the time this post was created this still applies for archer anyways)

I don't think the problem is that CTF is becoming more skill orientated, moreover I think the real problem is that Brawl wants to become a mix between MCPVP and Hypixel/Mineplex, of which those are 2 different types of servers, MCPVP which was more skill orientated and Hypixel and Mineplex are both minigame type, and in between you get an awkward hybrid that isn't quite suitable to enjoy. Currently, the server is heading that way. I don't know all the gamemodes in brawl but I do know there are the fun ones, like party,first person shooters, and survival, and then CTF, HG and KitPvP, which wouldn't make sense.