Idea Archer power bow rework

The punch is there for a reason. Archer's don't really have any other way to kite enemies, so their bow is their means of doing so.

It's not that difficult to kill an archer if you know how to do it correctly. You just have to move in unpredictable patters. If you run straight up to an archer, yeah, they're going to bow spam you.

 

There shouldn't be an incentive to bowspam. If you're an archer and you're not paying attention to your surroundings and someone does get to you, you should be punished by having to fight that person. Not "shoot him over and over till headshot."

 

Maybe a balance between both ideas? Like archer having power I and punch I? It'd reduce the bow-spamming and encourage slower, more focused shots. It wouldn't be that op, because archers normally don't get many kills anyway from just plain shooting.

 

Wow. Thanks for this enlightening post Flavorous.

 

When archers bow spam other archers .-.

 

A decent Archer can read your movement and knock you away anyway.

As an arguable Archer main, Bow Spam Punch is really really good. I can go for full charge shots rather than literal bow spam. This allows me to keep enemies far away from me before they can even get in range to hit me.

I'm in favour of actually disabling Archer's bow for a second or two after every shot. This means that charging and aiming shots becomes more valuable, rather than bow spam. This also gives Elf a place as the close range Archer, as they don't have to wait for their bow to work again.

 

@LordofAsians that would be a good idea, but a fully charged shot would rape chemists. XD

 

Yeah probably.

 

You all knew I was going to respond eventually xD

I would just avoid trying to compare how big problems are relative to other problems in this case. Other people are going to argue with you and say that something else is more important, and it's just not worth the effort. It's a problem, it exists, but it's debatable whether it's the biggest.

Agreed that it needs to change. You can't click too fast or the arrow won't even register as being fired.

Ok, so basically, what you're trying to do is replace a benefit for hitting a target with the bow at short range, with another benefit for hitting a target with the bow at short range? This is completely counter-productive. The only difference here is that instead of knocking them back it's going to take fewer shots to kill them. The power effect on the bow still applies irrespective of how much you draw the bow back, so you're still going to deal more damage than you otherwise would. This isn't going to stop bowspam anywhere near as much as you think it's going to. Sure, it might stop a few who see no reason to bowspam without that knockback into potential headshot range, but the majority will still hit a few arrows on the way in because it's a more effective way to deal more damage than it used to be. I'm sorry, but it's just not going to solve the problem you seem to think it will.

It can already deal moderate damage with a bow so long as you use it right, and most good archers will use the sword. The bad archers are going to bowspam, yes, but as already stated above this fix is simply not going to fix the problem.

Agreed, but it's also true the punch on the bow is also encouraging bowspam, which I don't see as a good thing. I think what's needed here is a fix, just not the fix being put forward in the thread. As already mentioned, it doesn't actually solve the problem. What's really needed is a different fix which allows archers to kite without encouraging bowspam.

Bowspam = quantity over quality. Chances are even if you move in an unpredictable way one will hit you. It's very inefficient, but it can get the job done, which is why bad archers use it. That can be fixed, it just needs the right rework

 

While I don't necessarily agree with this rework, I certainly do think that Power will cause less bow spam than Punch. Simply put, Power bow spam is much more manageable than Punch bow spam. This is because, while you will take more damage, you will at least be able to eventually get close to the Archer and beat the living daylights out of them. Punch promotes campy gameplay. If someone gets close to me, I'll start to run and shoot arrows at them, kinda kiting them around. Either I knock them far away and they're no longer a threat, or I retreat back to my team where I can have support and Medic heals.

With Power, I have incentive to actually fight now. I can't just shoot them and forget about them, because they're not going to be knocked 10 miles away from me. But I do get increased damage output, so maybe I can weaken them with a few shots before they get close and finish them off with my sword.

Unless you're fighting a Ninja, Assassin, or Engineer, an Archer forced to use their sword will die to a competent player 80% of the time unless that player is already injured. I actually think the bow is the best way to deal with enemies that are close. By landing one arrow, you knock them back far away and you can make a retreat to the rest of your team, either for heals or for your team to deal with your pursuer.

Archer is infinitely stronger when it's got a team backing it up. With a team, you rarely need to rely on your sword at all. The only time I ever really use my sword is to kill Ninjas, finish off weakened enemies, or as an option to force the opponent off me quickly.

My rework disables the bow for 1 second (time is up for change) after firing. It may be seen as extreme by some though. I think the best way deal with bow spam while keeping Archer relatively the same is to have the bow only get Punch 2 when fully drawn back. Maybe give it Punch 1 when half drawn back. This removes the effectiveness of bow spam as a get-off-me option, and forces Archers to aim in order to knock their enemies away.