CTF Class Tweaks

Archer: Its ok. Dunno if the extra bit of damage will count towards the archer or as a flagpoison/firedamage/highplace kill

Medic:
Yes
Chemist:
90 seconds seems a bit much for 5 potions. Maybe around 60-70 seconds

Dwarf:
Making dwarf useless isn't on a priority list. Its already significantly nerfed as it is. You have plenty of time to kill it with fire/poison/assassin/whatever (even tho poison II still hurts it) before it gets to max level

Mage:
As I discussed with @Bhlue No
Necro:
I could get behind the pickaxe thing if they reverted mob AI to the original coding for necro. That and replace spiders with W-Skeletons

Pyro:
Meh. Sure why not. Max it at like 6 seconds for a full draw
Ninja:
Ok. I'm fine with this, I'll start kissing my elf survivability goodbye later.

 

Theres other ways to do it. Frenzy the ****e outta it before level 10, Poison it (cuz poison resist doesn't work), pure element it, or hell you could damage spam with mage or buffed heavy it. Anything can get the job done if effort is put in. Assassins just the easiest at doing it.

 

^ I think once you understand the physics of the arrow, you'll be able to hit more cx

The tweaks sounds all ok, just the problem whether it'll actually be noticed and implemented.
+1

 

That sounds like a personal problem. >->

 

I like it

 

-1 to archers nerf, no matter what nerf archer will probably get it will make every single person camp outside with no worries about instantly dying. Engineers running amuck, tied games constantly because everyone will be by an engineer and be unkillable due to the cake.

Theres a simple way to avoid archer, actually avoid it. Every map has a route to avoid archers and you can literally outsmart archers by being extremely unpredictable or just going down underground routes instead of doing the same thing over and over, thats how you get sniped so much.

Archer getting nerfed would cause more bad things then good things and the staff knows this.

 

Archer:
I like it!

Medic:
I personally would go for a slower healing than less armor, but other than that +1!

Chemist:
+1

Dwarf:
Dwarf should have a little more of a rework, and I think it is fine for now. +0

Mage:
Interesting... might work. +0

Necro:
Ehh, don't think this really helps or hurts anything +0

Pyro:
+1

Ninja:
+1

 

Had the same idea for mage, I personally think it could work, only if brawl changed the lighting up a little bit, so they can't just kamikaze run into players and come out of it not taking any damage.

 

Yes i know this, and people care enough to reply so whatever. Ctf will die before archer or assassin or both get an instakill nerf or will shortly die after

 

Couldn't put this much better. Irrespective of whatever you want to happen to archer, it's instakill is going to get removed. It's been clearly stated it will be, and so it's going to happen. At this point trying to argue the opposite is beating a dead horse. Our time would be better spent doing what @Daniellll has attempted to do here, and come up with a viable solution to the problem

 

there will not be any viable solution to archers instakill being nerfed, it would make ctf implode from the inside out no matter what. MAYBE I wouldnt complain archer being nerfed if every other class got nerfed hard so they wont get a gigantic buff. Ex. engineer, chemists, soldiers.

 

I'm going to explain this just once more, very clearly, so that hopefully you'll understand. If you don't then there's nothing more I can do.

Irrespective of whether you think there's going to be a viable fix to archer or not, the fact remains it WILL be changed. If you don't think anything is viable, it's still going to be changed to something you find viable. That means the best course of action is to begin suggesting ideas, like @Daniellll which come up with a reasonable solution to removing the instakill. The point of removing instakill is to make archers less powerful (not an instakill as a pose to one). What you're saying in the second half of the post is that you wouldn't complain if everything else was nerfed to keep archer as powerful as it is right now. That counterracts the whole point of nerfing it in the first place. The point of this is to nerf it, and given some of the kill hauls I've managed to acquire with the class, I can completely understand why. Why you seem to think archer is balanced right now is beyond me, but irrespective, it's going to be changed to none instakill, and you're gonna have to get used to that idea

 

God and people call me dense, you are either dense or just having a egotistical episode.

Okays lets get started, I'm up for any "viable" solution the STAFF can come up with, because lets face it, they wont listen to us about ctf ideas and theyll just move any ideas from this to the server ideas section where it belongs. The only reason we got a tiny update change was because it was easy for 1, 2 because of quarrelt.

You buff up your own opinion on the point that archer is super op, but it really isnt. YOU, brandino, risabu, a few others make archer op. Not every archer is you or brandino. So that ends that pointless ego stroke you gave yourself there.

You are putting words in my mouth, I do not think archer is balanced, it is op if the archer knows what they are doing. I have never said archer is balanced balanced, its instakill is a necessary evil just as much as assassins instakill is.

I'm fine with the idea, im just going to enjoy when it backfires(hahaha, unintentional) and the game goes to total crap.

You can complain about archer because you get 50 killstreaks all the time because you are a god archer, but please remember that this isnt about you chaos, this is about the server, you are just one archer thats good at the class, 90% of archers are nowhere near as good as you or brand.

 

Dense means stupid, naive means I don't think about what I say before I say it. Given I put some clear thought into clearly explaining what I said initially to you, the latter point is invalid. Hopefully by the end of this post you'll understand why your former point is also wrong.

Brawl is a business, and basic economics and business studies states clearly that the staff have to give the customer (the community) what they want or face ruin. It's not just enough to give us an update, they have to give us an update we want/approve of. If the community doesn't like the changes being made, more people will leave, meaning even fewer people will be around to buy ranks/donate, which means less money for brawl. This means lower profits/losses for brawl and eventually they'll have to close. The staff have to listen to us (across the whole brawl community, not just CTF) or brawl will inevitably die. That means if they want to keep the server running they have no choice in the matter. So far they've just gotten lucky that the community have been patient with them for this long, and this patience is fast running out. If they want to continue they can, but it'll lead to financial ruin, so I seriously doubt it.

No you see that's where you're wrong. I'm not "buffing" my opinion solely because of how I personally experience the class. I've said on numerous suggestion threads similar to this before that I interpret it from the perspective of the average player to the class. Sure we must also take into account the true extent of the ability of the class, there's no doubt exploiting it to it's fullest means that things become ridiculous. I've thought about archer long and hard for a good while (I've had quite a long time) and I still think it's overpowered for even a regular player. I'll explain why:

Archer counters absolutely everything long ranged. There's no class with a passive immunity to it, only an active toggle, and even then there's not really much anyone can do long range to an archer back, other than another archer of course. The aim of archer was indeed to counter things long ranged. However I'd argue it's too good at that. Currently at that range, as long as that arrow hits, there's absolutely nothing you can do to save yourself, the archer will instantly kill you, irrespective of the damage. Changing this to a none-instakill but still powerful shot (such as the one mentioned in this thread) Gives the opportunity for a player to at least attempt to save themselves, which I believe is much fairer than the system currently. It still allowed archer to dominate the long range, whilst still gives the player a chance to save themselves (in this case with steak)

Short range, archer is meant to be countered by just about everything, and the reality is it isn't. Archer armor, steak and the punch on the bow mean that less bulky classes really can't kill it very easily at all. Ninjas and assassins find it very hard to kill an archer in the right situation (even with the assassinate archers have a sword and so can block). Medics and elves can also struggle to fight an archer. The punch, whilst weaker, is still more than enough to cause some serious damage before you can finish an enemy off with a sword, and at times it can allow you to take on bulkier enemies than yourself. Archer is by no means weak short range, even when it's supposed to be.

Those are the basic reasons why I think archer is overpowered and needs to be changed. This applies to archers of all abilities as anyone can capitalise on these class abilities. This is of course to different extents given not everyone is as able with the class. It shouldn't be hard to learn to do any of these things, and most of them are inherent to the class anyway. I think it's rather naive you assume that I only said what I did taking into account my own skill level when I never hinted that in my original post. Oh and because I also didn't mention myself that means I'm also not giving myself an ego stroke.

In that case you've been implying it for quite some time, and I think you should have probably been more explicit about it. However, regardless of whether or not you believe the instakill is a necessary evil, the fact is instakill is going to be removed, from both classes. You'll just have to get used to that idea

What if it doesn't backfire? You're assuming that there isn't a solution to the problem and that nobody on here has any good ideas how to handle the situation. There are over 850 threads in the CTF server ideas section, and like I said earlier, brawl is a business and will have to listen to the community if they want to survive. I'm sure there's at least a couple good ideas in those 850. I'm sure a few will be workable into the game, and would please the majority of the community. Can't be unanimous of course, you're always going to annoy someone with change, but a majority would at least be good enough. I think you're not open minded enough to see the alternatives.

Again, just going to point out in my original post in response to you I didn't actually mention myself once. I was pointing out that instakill was going to be removed whether you like it or not, and you chose to assume that meant I was all for it and I was clearly only thinking about myself. You're wrong because of 2 things. The first: that I never mentioned anything about what I thought, I just stated instakills would be removed, because it's been confirmed. I stated that it would be more helpful to come up with a useful solution rather than complain that it's going to happen, which is exactly what you were and continue to do. The second is that you clearly assumed that I was only thinking about my experience in game. I was thinking about everyone in this, from new players to veterans, and I was also considering other classes in relation to archer. Your assumptions in this case are wrong.