Assassin Discussion

I kind of agree assassin could maybe use a buff. I never really noticed it before this thread, but geez, assassin IS kinda underpowered xD. I have a couple of suggestions for a buff or two:

-decrease cooldown time? It DOES take quite long for it to be strong again, which is kind of annoying.
-It gets two redstone instead of one? (The cooldown would stay the same as it is now.)Because with assassin, with one mis-hit, you're as good as dead. If you waste your redstone and find out two seconds later you need it NOW, you'll still have one left.
-Golden/iron/diamond helmet? Its armor is kind of lousy, so maybe SLIGHTLY better armor to go with the boots? Maybe.
-Like ninja, assassin would always have speed? In my opinion this would be better than having to scroll to sugar every time.

Like I said, these are just suggestions. You don't have to like them, but I thought they could maybe be useful.

 

It's not underpowered, you've just got to be good at it. There are many good spots on maps where assassin's can ambush people and it's not hard too hard to take. You said that an assassin will almost certainly die as a bad thing however that is part of the class. It does huge amounts of damage but does very quickly. Assassin could be changed but it's not a huge problem compared to dwarf and perhaps engineer.

 

It's not really underpowered, but I do agree with @Rhos_ that it could use maybe a miniature buff. About the easy death, maybe a small extra amount of armor could be helpful.

 

Remove it & give everyone their money back

 

If it should be removed, what other variation of a recovery class should it be replaced with?

 

Ninja (with a few changes)

 

my opinion on this is that assassin and ninja are essentially the same: both have great damage and have nice mobility. after 1.9 theres gonna be no way to make the 2 different except a COMPLETE rework

 

I'll be that person. We have no dev for ctf and even then, there are other parts of ctf that should probably be reworked first (archer, engineer, dwarf, etc.)

 

First of all,

Spoiler: Recovering

for recovery assassin is mainly a chasing class to stall and possibly kill, it's perfect for recovery when the flagholder is still running: assassin has the speed advantage against any class (not counting ninja's pearl) and should be perfectly capable of catching up to the flag carrier, if not killing them before they reach the flag. In stalemates assassin usually is pretty hard to do stuff with because of the fact, which you stated, that the carriers are usually blocking 24/7. If you get a decently coordinated recovery squad you should be able to assassinate it, mostly in surprise attacks / the flag carrier running without blocking. But for example, if a soldier has the flag on Blackout during a stalemate, an assassin is indeed most likely not going to do anything if it didn't kill the carrier while running. But there's plenty of other classes that can make up for this, as you said yourself, like ninja. I wouldn't underestimate assassin's importance in recovery at all because it's still the only melee class that is still capable of instakilling.

Spoiler: Random killing

one of the easiest classes to get a dozen of kills in one game, you can hide behind any corner and instakill anything coming through. In any match on the match server (scrimmages / officials / unofficials / ppms) you rarely get an opportunity to do random killing though, basically every player in those games knows about the threat assassin can and will be. Waiting for redstone is indeed boring af but is necessary, if an assassin would get the redstone back even faster than right now it would be unstoppable against certain groups of players or teams. Like this you have to do more strategizing as assassin than simply run in and try to assassinate. As you said yourself, faking an assassinate is an option and this does work sometimes depending on the target player.

Spoiler: Defensive

I agree partially on this, the old times of the flagroom camping assassin are over. The only way to defend in a decent way is to roam -in my personal opinion and experience-, there indeed is no way that you're going to kill chemists / heavies / soldiers or even ninjas coming in your flagroom unless you get maps like skyworlds where you can simply crit them off edges and have them fall into the void and die a horrible death. As I said before, if you want to be a real good assassin the best way is to find spotsa around the map, close to the flagroom or even closer to midfield, and simply kill the offense when it's not watching. ssassin is the perfect backstabber, it can easily kill an entire offensive wave by simply sneaking behind -assuming the assassin does this unnoticed- and right-click left-click them in no time. I also should mention that assassin is probably the only class that is perfectly targetting a single player and getting away with it, such as taking out the medic to make sure the foe's offense gets no heals and is easily killed by stronger melee classes; heavy, soldier, pyro,...
Conclusion: assassin still has a crucial role on defense, also because of it's instakill.

Spoiler: Offensive

Assassin is pure diseases on offense. The odds of an assassin reaching the pyro in the flagroom are very small, simply because of all the other players on the foe's defense. Several teams use a ninja on defense and I think any assassin main can tell how easily it gets killed by ninjas. So simply a big no to assassin as an offensive class. HOWEVER sometimes it can be very useful to charge in and distract other classes (ninja) to make sure a medic or a chemist gets through. Or to kill the pyro in a less defended flagroom after having recovered the flag. But apart from this, I don't think assassin's got much use on offense.

Sorry rhos but what you said here seems not to be even close to my impression of assassin.

 

You see, chasing isn't a useful option. I'm not sure if I mentioned it before but the best way to surprise your enemies is to either hide behind some object or simply deathdrop (like on blackout where you can simply jump down and kill the flag carrier while falling). And for the stalling part, any class can stall, assassin simply can get in front way easier than earth spell or ice (which is something that can miss). Earth spell can also be spammed and counted as a violation of MMR, meaning that the team that stole the flag could get a free cap.

 

this
has
to
be
a
JOKE

 

In a world where recovery is not a role...

 

A lot of the class's power relies on chance (AND PING/THE LACK THEREOF). Though, since its power spectrum is extreme (able to instakill), its odds are easily favored even if not 100% dependable. Like in a stalemate, usually only sudden IMMENSE damage can pull off a recov, while gradual wearing away hardly does much but cause some commotion. A sneaky assassin could be the only thing to pull off a recov with its instakill power (just like the classes archer and pyro), while steadfast buffed heavies/soldiers/ninjas aren't normally as reliable to deal that type of concentrated damage to a well guarded flag carrier. As such, given the players and conditions, I see it favorable to rely on instakill power and luck.

(so i guess i like how assassin is atm xd maybe give it a slight buff if some other classes receive respective buffs as well)

EDIT: You make a good point comparing archer to assassin, and i'd have to agree that archer is slightly better in its instakill role (to be fair, archer is better than most things xd). In the end it depends on the players and (match) conditions.

 

The presence of an assassin forces players to block. It's hard to cap a flag while blocking. Sure, if your running around as a solo assassin you might have trouble killing players that know how to block. A good assassin + ninja/heavy makes both classes stronger

 

Nothing.

 

You got a point there

Wrong

If we're too far.

Noob Get Good.

Chemist is the hardest class, but still manageable.

Git Gud

Hiding is pretty useless, since carriers will still block because they have xray (jk). Get good.

You have a sword.

There is one guaranteed way to kill someone if you're successful.

It's expected to have an assassin in every game. Git GUd

Pretty sure flag carriers will still know.

That's kinda true for every class.

You got a point there. Not recommending to do this though.

Lol, except it isn't.

Ok.

True. Which is why a capper should enter first.

Can't die if you kill everyone.

Wrong!

K this reply was a semi-joke. At the same time, my reaction is pretty clear. Assassin is a pretty decent class if you can use it well. (which takes 3 years, you have to know the patterns of players)

Personally assassin is fine currently. (Obviously the rest of the community doesn't think so)

Sneaky Assassin?
Doesn't work. You have to play the game as if everyone has xray. That means winning head on battles.

@NorthUnited

 

By the class definition, Assassin is the staple glass cannon in CTF! Sure it's not perfect (nothing really is) but it does serve it's role. The class eliminates the target(s) while also being susceptible to death as well. High risk, high reward classes always brings out variety in their games. There's a need for classes like this and these days, everyone knows about blocking so it's really down to the ping time in the server at that certain moment.