Idea Necro Rework

Slowness does decrease your hit range a bit. That is also why most people don't go dwarf.
Cps and fps are different. It might confuse of trick new players, Example: New player is running to the enemy team's flag, Spider form Necro comes and attacks it, New player thinks 'why am i taking damage all of a sudden and why are my hearts green and why do i hear that weird noise.
It is also really annoying.

Forget what i said about poison particles, what about the action of taking damage and knockback, that would also confuse the new player.

 

Slowness actually does decrease the hit range. If you want evidence, give yourself slowness 4, hit an animal and do the same thing with speed 4 again. Compare the results and you will see the difference.

The reason i said that poison was not good for spider is because there is no cooldown to giving poison. An experienced pvper in spider form would easily incinerate a new player. However i also like the idea due to the fact that spider form does not currently have any pvp bonuses but please try to create a cooldown of giving poison.

 

If you think slowness does not change your hit range, keep think that although since slowness will not be implemented, i have no further reason to argue. This necro rework is extremely well written and i do not think that i could improve it by giving suggestions.

But i would still suggest extending the poison effect but creating a cooldown for giving it, which is longer then the time the effect actually lasts for.
Example: You can give poison 1 for 5 seconds but the cooldown for giving it is 10 seconds to make it more fairer and easier to use [that was just an example,do not take it seriously].
That's just my opinion because i feel like spider is pretty much a hit and run class when not used offensively.

The only thing that differentiates between soldier and spider is pretty much just the poison on shovel. I believe the soldier can wall climb when caught in medic web, if not the soldier can still easily break it. Jump boost 3 is similar to soldier wall climbing using the floor.

 

just saw this now o:

I really like it, and although it isnt too noob friendly, it's at least simple in regards to having the same hotbar for each form, but tbh necro isnt necro without at least its mob minions... id definitely like to see at least 2 mob minion companions with it, with cool-downs similar to how webmant put it for example or else it's a hard -1 hehe

Also, the skeleton doesnt look too hot... tbh the concept of being a blaze is sicc af and i would much much rather see the blaze switched in for the skeleton. The spider with its spidey eyes can take the skele's ability to see invis ninjas and also its speed whether as speed I or II (those tiny poison spiders r fast man). Not sure what u had before, but the blaze's attack can rely on fire and explosive -pure- damage (less powerful than zombie form damage but that's bc blaze would have some range on top of being pure damage). Like it is a bit in vanilla mc, I can see the blaze being more like a slow tank with maybe resistance II and the equivalence of slowness I or II. Additionally, the blaze should be able to levitate like an inch off the ground, fly upward with the equivalence of slowness III or IV, and fall/glide down like a feather and to take no fall damage.
tbh that's a lot cooler than the skele
and it'd also be nice to see the current xp system not go to waste - to have it integrated in for the necro's mob companions

With that said, id really love it
overall gr8 ideas and contemplation! too bad the community wasnt as advised with the last necro rework, but hopefully something can and will still be done instead of leaving the mistakes aside to work on new projects

 

I am curious, were you inspired by my post? I suppose I may as well bump that rework again since Necro still hasn't been properly reworked and since the push for a Necro rework seems revitalized. Anyhow, the rework is good, but I feel as if the forms aren't distinct enough (each of them just seems like the same form but with a different passive ability). But complexity isn't always the key to a great rework, so you can keep the rework idea as is without much issue.

 

I don't really care if you think or know that slowness does not impact on hit range, poison is an excellent substituite but a cooldown would be nice.

Offensive does not just mean capping, also means supporting the capper, though i admit that poison would be good at slowing down anyone that attacks the capper.

If you told me the speed of climbing, i probably would have included the speed of climbing in my reply, but you are probably gonna have to decide the climbing speed for this to be implemented.

 

I suppose I might be looking at this in comparison to my own rework, but I suppose the main issue I see with your proposed rework is that the forms don't seem like they have sufficiently different playstyles. Your rework seems to have hard-hitting, slow, tanky melee guy, speedy, pokey melee guy, and mobile, DoT melee guy as forms. It also seems to me that all the forms are rather weak and have too specific passive abilities (Brainless and Keen Eye in particular). Here are my critiques:

Zombie:
This seems to me to be drastically restricted by its inability to sprint normally. Its inability to sprint wouldn't be such an issue to me if it was just a bit better at being an anchor. In particular, I believe this could be achieved by revamping Brain Feast to include some regeneration (better anchoring ability) as well as changing Brainless to Numb, an ability that prevents Zombie from taking more than a certain amount of damage in a single hit (shifting Zombie from countering headshots to countering true damage and instakills in general), especially since Zombies, in their anchor role, would find it rare to be headshotted while they would find the true damage of Pyro and Chemists as well as the instakills of Assassins to be more common.

Skeleton:
This seems to me to be unnecessarily restricted to a sort of chaser role (which would likely be swapped to Zombie or Spider upon reaching its destination) and Ninja counter, restricting it from having a more unique and useable playstyle beyond that similar to Assassin's speed dust. It also seems to overlap a bit with Spider in terms of its mobility and would probably best benefit from not stepping on Spider's toes. Rather, I would see it best to implement Skeleton as a sort of ranged character with a bow with unique properties (you can feel free to take inspiration from my post for how the bow would work or you can come up with something yourself). Its melee abilities should, of course, be restricted and would probably function best if the Diamond Shovel lost a level of Sharpness or two. Keen Eye should also be revamped into two separate abilities, Skeletal Sense (Skeletons don't have eyes) and Skeletal Resilience. Skeletal Sense would allow one to see invisible Ninjas as well as be immune to vision-altering effects (Blindness and Nausea) while Skeletal Resilience would make Skeleton immune to Fire (bones dont burn easily at all) and other status effects which would obviously not affect the standard Skeleton.

Spider:
This one is the most flawed of all in my eyes. As a mobility form, it seems to completely fall flat. Wall Climb sounds like it would be too slow and even disruptive to gameplay (accidentally getting stuck on a wall much like how one would accidentally get stuck on a ladder) and Jump Boost 3 seems like it would severely hinder Spider's distance covering (sprint jumping speed would be severely reduced) as well as hinder Spider's combat ability (jumping would often result in heavy knockback if hit at the start of the jump, resulting in you being put far away from the enemy and the severely high jump height would prevent Spiders from being able to land crits, both factors resulting in Spiders losing a significant amount of combat mixup potential). In my opinion, Spider should play more like your original idea for Skeleton would play. Having Spider be Speed 2 while having a weaker Shovel and Resistance -1 would prevent it from taking a sufficiently viable combat role while making it retain a hit-and-run and mobile playstyle instead with poison and web immunity. In particular, I believe its Venom and Speed 2 will add a lot to its potential to play a hit-and-run style as well as to be used to properly chase and mesh with other forms. However, for Venom to be more viable, I would make it more a Debilitating Venom, adding Slowness I and Poison I. If I were to play with this Spider form, I would likely use its speed to catch up to an enemy, hit them once to apply Venom (nice bonus damage as well as slowing potential from Slowness I and Poison I causing downward/neutral knockback, slowing sprints and hindering jumps), and then either keep on a hit-and-run playstyle if the situation calls for it (flag carrier that is constantly running that the Venom would help other recoverers to take care of the flag carrier) or swap to Zombie or Skeleton Form (once again, depends on situation) to be better capable of fighting the enemy in a combat situation, especially while they are still Poisoned and Slowed, deprecating their combat potential as well as making sure they can't go anywhere fast to make Skeleton and Zombie (especially Zombie) play more effective.

 

I cannot decide if the speed mentioned in the video is good. You can decide the speed [tbh i dont really care since i would probably never use spider form if this was to be implemented].

So basically:

-Zombie form: Flagroom form??
-Skeleton form: Used for running to the enemy flag and back to your own flag??
-Spider form: Used for support and climbing up those difficult walls??

Please correct me if i am wrong.

 

The regeneration would be derived from Brain Feast, think of the Zombie being rejuvenated by the brain they are feeding on. And I mentioned that the inability to sprint wouldn't be an issue if it was a better anchor, so I proposed how to keep its inability to sprint with it not being something that would make Zombie near useless in my eyes. Particularly, the ability to regain health when it hits a foe would make it more competent in combat.

But yeah, this rework looks pretty good regardless, I appreciate the thought you put behind it.

 

Do you mean the spider gets speed 1 and gives slowness 1 on venom??

 

ok