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Idea CTFpixel

Discussion in 'Capture the Flag' started by notfleb, Aug 2, 2020.

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How would you rate the current casual CTF system?

  1. Phenomenal

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. Good

    10 vote(s)
    47.6%
  3. Bad

    10 vote(s)
    47.6%
  4. Unbearable

    1 vote(s)
    4.8%
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  1. notfleb

    notfleb Well-Known Member

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    This is essentially a more in-depth description of how CTF should ideally function outside of the competitive scene. Please note that this is all theoretical and subject to change, which you are more than welcome to suggest by replying.



    Server Capacity

    I know I'm quoting myself, but I'll say it here just for clarity: It has been evidently proven through PPMs that larger matches function far worse than smaller ones, let alone with a randomized mix of players with varying skill levels and/or knowledge of the game. To combat this, I believe reducing each server's capacity to 24 Players would be most optimal, as a 13v13 is typically the largest roster limit you'll see for a PPM (26 is just an ugly number :poop:). In addition, I believe the game startup (and the credit earning trigger in tow) should be increased to 18 or 20 players, so that we don't have the currently asinine 44 player gap possible for starting games; Credit earning would therefore always be "on" when a match starts, instead of the current imbalance which I still can't find any reasoning behind.

    Class Limits

    I want everyone to read this very carefully; I know the idea alone sounds idiotic to some of you, but just bear with me here. The following list is just what came to my mind while making this thread; Feel free to constructively modify it as you see fit if/when you reply.
    • Heavy, Soldier: 5
    • Medic, Ninja, Elf: 3
    • Archer, Mage, Assassin, Pyro, Dwarf, Engineer: 2
    • Fashionista can just be unlimited for the memes :stuck_out_tongue:
    This list ensures that, under most circumstances, you will always be able to play the class you want. Will there be times when you join a match with your desired class slots filled? Yes, but this list is also designed to minimize the amount of IQ exterminating class piles that can occur in the current casual servers. As far as selecting classes goes, I think keeping the current style works just fine.

    Map Rotations

    If you thought I was going to try to change this, shame on you. The current system is fine, and it really isn't the end of the word when back to back maps occur from switching servers. Implicating any sort of voting system will inevitably lead to abusive behavior if people get bored enough.



    Once again, this is just what came to mind when I was typing this out. You are welcome to offer any input you like, but please keep it civil for the sake of everyone's brains.
     
  2. Zarpin

    Zarpin #1 6ᴏʙʙʏ ꜰᴀɴ & ʙʀᴀᴡʟ ᴠᴏᴛᴇʀ (◕︵◕)

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    Can you add a "Fine" vote or something like that, because that's what I'd vote for, I don't have an opinion on whether it's bad or good, I guess I could just be weird.
    Is this a shot towards ItalianPenguin's PPMs? If so, I have to put my foot down against this hatred. Ital is a god among you plebeian.

    To be honest, I don't have much input, everything seems fine here. Only thing the class limits would do is stop the knowners from having a group of 8 mages walking around killing new players (sometimes the things these groups do is quite funny though). Class limits could honestly open up a new way to add another booster to CTF, since there aren't ever new ones. "Remove class limits" for an hour or two. Also, but what about when players join during a game and they automatically get put on their custom default class and couldn't you just set a new default class, re-log and be able to play it? Thoughts on this?
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Informative Informative x 1
  3. notfleb

    notfleb Well-Known Member

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    Ideally it would be coded to prevent that from happening. If possible, you could still set your default, but if the slot is taken, it will set your class to the next available one (which idk how that would work yet exactly). Like if all the free classes are taken and you don't own any premiums, I guess technically it would allow you to play a class you don't own if it redirects you to it. With smaller servers, you're going to have more of them active, so it with the average of 50-70 people playing at peak hours, you should be able to find a game where you can play what you want, unless there's some exceptionally scummy trolling going on.
     
  4. Salty_Ivan

    Salty_Ivan Well-Known Member

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    A single good offensive player, especially a chemist, can easily farm captures in a 12v12 if there are random players running around and some people not playing objective.

    If you're going to reduce the number of players per game, I don't think this is necessary. From the standpoint of a new player, they want to play their favourite class, and they may only like playing one class. There are so many people that play only archer, but what if there are already 2 archers on your team? I'm pretty sure on most maps in casual more than 1/6 of your team is archer. If a new player can't always play the class they want then it's going to drive them away. Keep in mind if they buy classes with credits, they must really like those classes and want to play them, and they don't really have the luxury of being able to flex onto many roles.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  5. Zarpin

    Zarpin #1 6ᴏʙʙʏ ꜰᴀɴ & ʙʀᴀᴡʟ ᴠᴏᴛᴇʀ (◕︵◕)

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    The problem with this would be: a new player gets put on a premium class for the entire game let's say, then after they're kicked off of it for the next game, they may be annoyed that they cannot play the same class again. Even more, if you were a new player (or even a regular), it's like a lottery ticket, you may get to play a really fun class (of their taste) and sometimes be forced to play a class they hate. Idk if I'm overthinking it, which I tend to do, but this is just what sprouted in my head. I like the idea of class limits, but I don't know if it would work in casual, it's one of those things that's a gamble, it may help the player-base or it may damage it. I also agree with what Ivan said. I didn't even think about that actually, if you reduce player size, then limits may not need to happen, if an entire team is archer in a 12v12, you can just ninja cap. I think limits in a 25v25 seems more viable.
     
  6. notfleb

    notfleb Well-Known Member

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    This is going to slightly counter what I've been saying about new players, but imo playing 1 class every second you're on CTF is a path to boredom and eventually quitting, as we've seen with Proterozoic. And quite frankly, I'd take any opportunity to minimize the amount of players that downloaded the game literal minutes before logging on that play archer or chemist and just spam right click without even moving. It forces people to adapt, but still offers the freedom most of the time; It's not like I'm trying to eliminate every annoying player on the server. People have different playstyles that are effective in their own ways, but sometimes it's better for the rest of us to not have to deal with some clueless kid getting in the way of objective gameplay simply because the class they play has an annoying feature. Would you honestly say you advocate Engineers that do nothing but run & tnt spam? Mages that only run & freeze/lightning? Ninjas that spend multiple minutes waiting for you to go afk just for that free kill? You can't stop them all, but this at least prevents some of it. If you want casual to function better, then maybe it is optimal to discourage people with those annoying playstyles from returning, as half the time that's the only thing they can do effectively.

    Like I said before, 13v13 is already pushing it with fully coordinated & experienced teams. Having anything more becomes utter chaos, and as Ivan said above, you get the infamous class piles where you can find literally 5-7 Archers on a single team that make gameplay an actual nightmare. Reducing server sizes is necessary to prevent this from happening, and while it alone works fairly well, you will still always have the potential threat of people doing intentional class piles like Color's Mage army. Also, as I said in the post itself, if you want to, you can modify the limits to what you see fit.
     
  7. Zarpin

    Zarpin #1 6ᴏʙʙʏ ꜰᴀɴ & ʙʀᴀᴡʟ ᴠᴏᴛᴇʀ (◕︵◕)

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    So you think to give up some players for more functionality and sanity? This does sound nice...
     
  8. notfleb

    notfleb Well-Known Member

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    Obviously doesn't sound appealing to the people that want the most player friendly server, but with how much toxicity and infighting this server has experienced already, there isn't much else to do except find ways to make it harder for scums & ****ters to continue being effective in casual. The people that target new players do it for two reasons: being really bad or being really annoying. If the machine gun Archers aren't around to begin with, then that at least solves half the problem; Handling skill gap targeting is up to the player's team, as staff aren't always able to jump in and stop it from happening.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  9. Salty_Ivan

    Salty_Ivan Well-Known Member

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    It's not only these types of players that you discourage from returning though. You can discourage everyone from returning. And there are also people who can play one class every single day and have fun with it.

    While I agree server sizes need a reduction, 12v12 is a bit extreme.
     
  10. notfleb

    notfleb Well-Known Member

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    If you don't feel like coming back to a 100 player server because you can't play a certain class I'm not really gonna be surprised... js. Yes, people can & have played the same class straight for years at a time, but it ultimately creates an unhealthy environment where the regs capitalize on the key weakness(es) of that class every time they fight you, and more often than not intentionally target you briefly to try to make you stop playing entirely. That's just what this server is like, so if you weren't aware of that somehow, that's the crude explanation for it.

    My original thought for reduced server sizes was 15v15; still too small? Your thoughts?
     
  11. Salty_Ivan

    Salty_Ivan Well-Known Member

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    I'd prefer 20v20, 15v15 is still too small.
    Yes, it's big in a ppm but in a casual game where there are people doing nothing and people who don't play objective very well then it's essentially maybe a 9v9 with very low average skill level.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  12. Jalkar_the_Melon

    Jalkar_the_Melon New Member

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    I agree on everythinjg, except as @Salty_Ivan says, I'd prefer 20v20s.

    On the whole, some really good ideas!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. _Pai

    _Pai Well-Known Member

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    I say the casual experience is poor because the primary objective, capturing the flag, is very hard in casual. Most people play defense, and when people push up its never coordinated, which means you have to solo cap against a bigger defense than any competitive game. Although the defense in question is on average less skilled than a competitive game, it's still very hard to solocap against a lot of people even for good players. As a result ithe majority of the game turns into TDM.

    This is admittedly fun sometimes, but when new players join the server, all they know is that there's a flag that has to be captured, so they'll likely go for the objective first and foremost and fail and get discouraged.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. JaxonCA12

    JaxonCA12 Member

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    Class Limits would be good for the game. Only problem is, not everybody has all of the classes unlocked. What happens when a new player tries to join a game where Heavy, Medic, Soldier, and Archer are all maxed out?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
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