Rate the CTF Classes 3: Balance

No, he wasn't. And if he was then how on earth is chain-mail armor "absolutely disgusting for gameplay"? (@mh__ )

What.

Really?

lol ok. Dude, even Archers see Archer as an issue (@pookeythekid).

Define 'most of the time'.

That's true in a flagroom but y'know, an Assassin could just sneak up on a solo target and kill them (because they aren't blocking most of the time because almost no one blocks most of or all of the time if they're being distracted or not). No teamwork required.

Alrighty then.

That's somewhat true if removing Archer's instant kill was a standalone change in the current meta.

I am not arguing for removing (or removing and reworking) Archer's instant kill and changing nothing else but my previous post was not very clear about that. So to clarify, that's not what I'm arguing for although I can see how you thought it was.

That is exactly what I'm doing.

Yeah... that's not true.

True since (as @mh__ said) the meta is greatly dependent on Archer's instant kill etc. etc.

Yep!

Okay let me make sure I understand the logic here: 1) Fixing CTF would require a great big update with lots of changes. 2) If that update was a nerf it would cause gameplay to take a nose dive. 3) You want the gameplay to take a nose dive? 4) CTF is not 100% healthy but Archer's and Assassin's instant kills are a 'necessary evil'.

This is the very definition of a slippery slope argument. For starters, we have no idea what would happen if a big update nerfed the meta because we're talking about a hypothetical here and a non specific one at that. Second, @mh__ never said he wanted the game to receive a great big nerf, he just mentioned fixing it with an update (i.e. a combination of nerfs and buffs) so the meta isn't needlessly codependent around a ranged (and free!) instant kill class. And finally, just because a future update MAY make things worse, is not a reason that the status quo should be remotely acceptable.

Archer's sheer strength comes from it being able to mow down enemies from 30-50 blocks away with little to no fear of retaliation. Punch II, as much of a short ranged pain as it is/was, is nowhere near as good as that.

Me neither. @pookeythekid and @ACE_BLUE2 are some pretty cool dudes.

 

I heard my name yes I do have problem with archer kthxbai

 

My problem with archer is it is not punished for missing a target. Archers can shoot arrows down like hell fire and get many kills from my experience. I only just stayed in 1 area and blindly spammed arrows into mid and got well over 30 kills.
Archer not being punished for missing, along with it's high tier armor, good health pool, punch, and a decent sword make it pretty broken in my eyes. Any archer who is half decent at pvp will do pretty well in a meelee scenario. This shouldn't be the case. Archer should be weak in close combat, as it is a ranged class. Run out of arrows? No biggie, just walk back to spawn/flagroom and get a medic and go back to shooting everything that moves. Low on health but no medic or chemist near? No biggie, just go wait a few seconds in spawn then respawn yourself and continue mowing down everyone.

Archer needs to be punished for missing a shot. With an ability as powerful as it's snipe it has to have a strong weakness aswell.
Let's use a FPS game for example. Sniper-based classes can't afford to miss most of the time. If they miss, they give out their position, waste limited ammo, and take time reloading. This isn't the case with archer. Archer's can miss without most people noticing due to how unnoticeable a moving arrow is, how quiet it is, and how it deletes itself on contact with the ground. The only way to know there's an archer shooting at you is if you are specifically looking out for archers or just happen to glaze upon an arrow.

Tl;dr: Archer should be punished for missing a shot and become weaker in meelee.

 

Eh, i agree, like i've said, im fine with any nerf to archer that doesnt remove instakill. I do agree that archers should be punished for missing a shot, and tbh, i think they should make you unable to respawn once you leave spawn, only way you respawn will be when you die, than you can switch to one class and leave, repeat.