Sharpness I Medic Poll

Medic is a support class. It shouldn't be focused on killing anything. Of course people are going to focus the medic with its OP heal and all. That's why you need to protect the medic. Also, webs are a lot more useful than a sword if used correctly, and I know a few medics who can use those webs effectively. Take Reuben for example. That man has got to be the best medic I've ever known, and his webs were some of the best I've ever seen. He could web the entire defense in one web and solo cap. Webs are not the hardest thing to learn in the game, and if you just aren't skilled enough to use your webs in a useful manner, that's your fault.

Also, I think you're mistaking the roles in support. Support is a bit of a blanket term, but it usually boils down to two types of support, healing and killing. Medic, chemist, and mage can all use their healing abilities to physically heal the flag carrier. However, any class can perform the killing aspect of support. Killing recov is not something medic should be focused on, seeing as medic is most useful for healing support. It's not supposed to be killing recov. If your flag carrier dies because you only had the medic guarding the flag carrier: First, that's an incredibly dumb idea unless you have some actual skill to back it up, and second, that's completely your fault for not having someone else to defend the medic. Of course the medic is obviously going to be the closest support to the flag carrier so they can heal them in the shortest amount of time possible, but medic itself should not be focused on killing the recov and should leave it to other classes.

 

Difference between focused on killing stuff vs. being able to kill stuff

i.e. Thresh in LoL can go 5-0 vs adc going 0-0-5. Not supposed to happen but can - and does (i am a thresh main) - because Thresh q-e-empowered auto

All this does is focus the game around the medic. If the heal is such an issue, nerf the heal. Ctf shouldn't be about targetting the "annoying player" anyway

Ok. Ping is also a factor but that's beside the point. None of this ^^ is relevant to the argument - which is that webs are only a temporary slow (if they hit an enemy) and even more temporary if accidentally destroyed by an ally - so they are not very useful when ur getting strafed and whaled on by a ninja or chemist

Giving medic an additional 0.5 on hit attack damage will not make it the go-to class for killing flag carriers lol

literally the only thing a sharp 1 buff does is allow medic to more effectively defend itself and allies. it does not make it a carry, just less likely to get sniped by a ninja

with the equivalent of a stone sword?

Since when was a sharp 1 buff so OP that it makes medic the equivalent of Kayn support?

 

Webs are hard to land? We are talking about possibly a few blocks apart from another player, landing an item which takes up an entire block of space. And yes, if the situation arises you must kill the recovery, but for crying out loud its really not that difficult to focus on a ninja which has no armor and probably less than 10 hearts cause they pearled towards flag carrier, and you can kill in 3 hits tops. And then again, if the recovery is primarily focusing you, stopping back and trying to kill them will still drop you on hearts even if you have an additional sharpness on your sword. Webbing and running and sustaining as much steak/health will be more beneficial in that situation, especially if you're trying to support, and in that case if its really unavoidable, the flag carrier also has a sword and can swing it to the recovery too.

Who on earth are you kidding. I'd take a medic that runs away and webs any day over a buffed nearly impossible to kill medic team. And anyways, if you think webbing and running is bad, mage on its own does pretty much the same thing if not worse.

medic can still kill stuff, and it is not difficult either. I don't think a medic should have the capabilities to single-handedly take down a heavy/soldier/chemist just because of its damage output. Those are the classes people complain about when playing as medic, but should you really expect to deal more damage against classes that are designed in that way when you're playing a class which is designed more for support than carrying?

Good point on Thresh in LoL. Yes, he can carry as a troll adc or go 5/0/0 but so can the current medic, just you shouldn't expect to get that kind of score when you fight high damage output classes, just like you shouldn't expect to survive against a high dps champ if you were that score as thresh, assuming both of you are similarly fed.

Actually, this change changes the entire meta and the way offense works out. The buff makes medic a jack of all trades (with the exception of recovery), it can sustain itself with a high damage output as a flag carrier, can easily hoarde off offense waves and crowd control with webs. It would disrupt all the classes effectiveness completely. Pyro and ninja would barely put up a fight against the medic because of the change, not to mention the higher damage classes like heavy and chemist, as it will be able to beat them with ease and possibly survive with still retaining 1 or 2 steaks.

Agreed for the heal. As @Lugia_ mentioned, either keep it as it is or reduce the health pool/healing effectiveness, but that would seriously weaken its supportive role and make it a more damage class than a supportive class.

Webs will allow you to escape from a chemist, take maybe one or 2 webs and he'll be slowed down enough for you to make a run and cross to a different path. As for ninja, if they attempt to pearl out of the web, that way they lose 2 hearts, so it makes it all the easier to kill the chasing ninja.

Rather contradictory. If the 0.5 on hit attack damage won't make such a big difference to its kit, why the need to implement it now? Receiving buffs every now and then will be the equivalent of having this extra damage, and even so, refer to my web argument above against a ninja. However you also seem to forget the impact the damage change would have on medic teams, such a dilemma is not really thought of when suggesting to add back sharpness I

Which instantaneously becomes the equivalent of more damage than an iron sword when also given with buffs. The stone sword also deals a hell loada damage than it otherwise does without.

Since medic was capable of single handedly beating heavies in 1v1s with ease before the sharpness nerf , without even the necessity of any buffs

 

Ya I get you. That's why you remove a steak or nerf the heal.

Rapid heals encourage a need for rapid kills. Otherwise healing supports end up being so strong ctf becomes the minecraft equivalent of laning against a fed soraka.

My point is that its harder to web chemists or ninjas (or soldiers, come to think of it), than soldiers, necros, pyros, etc. high mobility over low mobility

Two reasons: 1) medic is too focused on healing & cc support and not on alternative playstyles, 2) way too easy to kill for a support class

Medic teams aren't as much of an issue after the 15 second heal cooldown was added. But, again, I'm not in favor of rapid heals (Medic and Mage's heals are the equivalent of regen 5) so I'd like to see those nerfed.

Yes but we're not talking about medic in terms of if it is buffed. Like, you're saying "well it's a pretty strong sword if Medic gets a buff that makes it do 145% more damage" ya that's the case with any weapon

That had a lot more to do with medic's healing and crowd control than the damage.

As for medic "carry" I have nothing against alterntive playstyles. Personally, I'd like to see medic become more versatile than it is, but not so strong in roles other than support that it ends up like chemist in its "armored ninja" days

 

@Miskey hello you should post the ideas you had here

 

I've already shared my opinions within the staff team. I'll post the eventually, but my ideal changes are the rework I posted.

 

Contorary to popular belief, medic is not a heavy hitter.

I looked at armor points and damage values on Minecraft wiki and came up with this: Before the nerf, medic dealt 1.5 hearts to heavy while heavy could hit with 2.5 hearts. Considering heavy's health of 22 hearts and medic's of 34 hearts, you would end up with heavy on the top with an extra 1 heart if they traded hits equally and used all their steak.

What about medic's natural regeneration? Natural regeneration heals half a heart every 4 seconds, and a fight like this will last 10-20 seconds. This is because it will take 14 hits to kill a medic as heavy, and the buffer between each hit is 0.5 seconds, giving an estimated time of 7 seconds if there was no delay per hit. Now of course Minecraft has lag and not everybody is a god so I will give 15 seconds (that's less then one hit per second). Medic will have regened 1.5 hearts in the time of the fight, giving medic the 0.5 hearts advantage to completely demolish heavy in this totally one-sided match. Does this mean heavy lost according to my calculations? Yes. Does this happen in real situations? Probably not.

This medic would literally have to steak every 2 seconds, meaning it would have to switch slots, left click, and switch back, interrupting the flow of pvp and distract it from the fight. Perhaps a very experienced player could do this with no problem at all, but most players will struggle or even panic from this constant multi tasking. Besides, it's almost instinct for any new CTFer to run away from a full diamond armored, diamond sworded enemy, likely resulting in lowered confidence and a loss. I doubt a new player could even utilize the steak mechanism, let alone use it fast enough to outlast a heavy.

Overall, heavy would win, and this was before the nerf. After the nerf, medic became so easily targeted. Take archer as another targeted class for example. It has a headshottabe bow, better sword, and even armor! Why should it have a sword if it's a ranged class? Because it should be able to defend itself if it ever got targeted. Shouldn't medic at least have a stone sword equivalent too?

Currently, new players will only play heavy, archer, or soldier out of the free classes. This is because they would rather kill people then heal teammates. They aren't interested in the objective. This buff will draw attraction to medic and let more people support.

If medic is too op, I wouldn't nerf it somewhere where it was already lacking in like it's damage, but rather it's healing capability.

 

I've just been sitting here rating stuff, but relevant to what you last said(ya I know it's not too related to sharpness), drawing attraction to people playing medic could also happen if it had a way to get credits through healing. Say what you will about sharpness, thats clearly controversial, but every class should get some amount of credits for its role provided. And seems like everyone agrees the medic role is support/healer, so I really hope sometime in the future medics able to get credits for that.

 

i think medic needs sharpness 2

 

Yes, just as how assassin is not supposed to be used as a capping class, yet others can cap with assassin. Does that mean we should give assassin more steak so it can cap easier?

All this does is focus the game around the medic. If the heal is such an issue, nerf the heal. Ctf shouldn't be about targetting the "annoying player" anyway
We already nerfed the heal? Besides, medic is the only class with the most direct and substantial heal ability, making it the prime target of any recov. The only ways to solve this would either be
a. Reducing the heal to equal that of a chemist health / regen potion or mage regen potion.
b. Introducing another healing class that can heal the same amount as medic.

Ok. Ping is also a factor but that's beside the point. None of this ^^ is relevant to the argument - which is that webs are only a temporary slow (if they hit an enemy) and even more temporary if accidentally destroyed by an ally - so they are not very useful when ur getting strafed and whaled on by a ninja or chemist
Webs are not just a temporary slow (which in the first place is an understatement). Those couple seconds that the enemy or enemies are trapped can allow you to escape and run well in front of your enemy, and those couple seconds difference between you and your enemies can be crucial when capturing the flag or recoving.

Webs are also a source of projectile knockback. They're similar to a nerfed version of ninja eggs. They do no damage, but they can break a combo / strafe, allowing you to then gain the upper hand (even if temporarily) in a fight. You don't have to web the player to be able to break the combo, but if you do web a player in the ground, you then can easily strafe and combo said player.

Giving medic an additional 0.5 on hit attack damage will not make it the go-to class for killing flag carriers lol
No it wouldn't, and I'm sorry if that's what my argument came off like. I was expressing that I didn't like how the general thought process by most people for medic being buffed is that "so it can kill recov easier and stay alive in 1v1's", both of which are not supposed to be in medic's focus.

literally the only thing a sharp 1 buff does is allow medic to more effectively defend itself and allies. it does not make it a carry, just less likely to get sniped by a ninja
Look at last paragraph vv


with the equivalent of a stone sword?
?


Since when was a sharp 1 buff so OP that it makes medic the equivalent of Kayn support?
I personally am not that against giving medic sharp 1 (if there is a nerf in the heal or healthpool). It's not a huge change, and I will completely agree with you that giving medic sharp one will not turn it into some sort of "Kayn support" (I don't play League). However, I don't like the thought process for buffing medic (in a general sense) due to its apparent inability to 1v1 / kill recov, both of which I think medic should not be focusing on at all. With a little twist on an Einstein quote:

If we judge a medic by it's ability to kill recovery, it will live its whole life thinking its underpowered.

 

first of all, BLUE TEXT

What you're saying is beside the point. No one wants to add sharpness I so medic can be the new carry. People want it back so that 1) medic doesn't have such a hard time in pvp and 2) medic's playstyle is less of "heal, throw snowballs, and run" but something more active & engaging.

I'm talking about nerfing the rapidheal. i.e. instead of constant regen 5, regen 4 or 3 after a certain number of hearts (that's one idea)

like i said earlier, rapidheals create a need for rapidkills. otherwise the meta is completely busted

I'd be good with either of those ^^ things tbh

yes

Not really true as medic doesn't do much damage and can be easily burst down by chemists or ninjas (although yes, medic is very tanky in the long run via regen)

That depends on what class the player is or whether or not the web is broken by teammates - as is often the case

i.e. i web someone in a teamfight. teamfights are so crazy that i or someone else might break the web by accident, making my cc almost worthless

Medic's focus is to support allies by keeping them as healthy as possible. I don't see the issue if Medic has multiple tools to achieve that aim, including heals but also other methods (i.e. fending off enemies to protect the carry/flag carrier)

Ok. We're talking about medic in two different contexts. I'm fine with a damage buff & steak removal and/or heal nerf also if, for no other reason, to reduce targetting of medics and to make medic's playstyle more interesting

 

incoming funny ratings

 

wait why not just remove the entire medic class???

 

medic is op :mad::mad:

 

thank you for that November