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Idea Ringwrather 's Ctf ideas

Discussion in 'Capture the Flag' started by Ringwrather, Sep 12, 2019.

?

Good idea

  1. Yes

    2 vote(s)
    22.2%

  2. No

    7 vote(s)
    77.8%
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  1. Ringwrather

    Ringwrather Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2016
    Messages:
    35
    Ratings:
    +21
    So as we know the testing for new flag timers just happend last week and we found some things that would need to be nerfed and buffed this post will mainly be about elf and pyro as the elf was to op against pyros with the instant grab of the flag and the water eliment.I have come up with a solution.

    ---- So we keep the Instant grab for some classes but not the faster moveing class (elf ,chemist maybe soldier). Have the normal grab time for them. This will help the pyro class a lot, making offence still fun and will make defence to have to still work hard.
    So now we have the problem of the water element countering the pyro completly I have thought of a way to rework the pyro to be able to counter elf's water element.

    1. Pyro instant kill frenzy should come back. This will make the teams to have to work more allowing defence to stop that one op player on the other team.

    2. When the pyro uses his frenzy in the elf's water element the water element on the ground goes away allowing the pyro to rain fire on the elf and others and being able to kill him (If opposite team is in water element and frenzy is used the player will still not be set on fire by the frenzy)

    3. Now elf's still counter the pyro a bit to much as if the team works together good. the pyro wont be able to get his bow ready if a player is already on the flag and sometimes it's hard to place fire with the flint and steal in the right place.With water element we are basically at were we are now so in that case the pyro should be able to hit a person with there flint and steal to set them on fire but it is a 1 time use with a cool down of course allowing the pyro to use his frenzy on the water element then set the flag holder on fire by hitting them with the flint and steal and deal that top tear damage with the axe

    These together make the elf still able to counter a pyro but at the same time give a pyro a chance to recover. This will make offence have to work together more and make pyro fun to play again.

    (Ps I love to use elf but let's be honest it's to op sometimes)

    Now please leave your thoughts here and give me a reply and add your ideas to fix this elf and pyro issue
     
    #1 Ringwrather, Sep 12, 2019
  2. Mnkynoodles

    Mnkynoodles ur mother

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2019
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    Ratings:
    +38
    1. Defense is already broken. No one really tries in casual ctf, so if you ever play in a match, it will make pyro even more "broken" on defense.
    2. This basically just buffs pyro even more in defense, adding onto instakill in a game where offense is already hard enough.
    3. Eh interesting but I don't think that would work well. Makes pyro even more easy to play if the other ideas were also applied.


    Overall, elf can get away from pyro, but you also have teammates to chase elf (ninja, assassin, etc) or you can just switch to ninja /assassin urself.

    Don't really agree with any of this. Sorry
     
    • Like Like x 5
    • Agree Agree x 1
    #2 Mnkynoodles, Sep 12, 2019
  3. Foodcourt

    Foodcourt CTF MOD

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2015
    Messages:
    141
    Ratings:
    +189
    Discord:
    Foodcourt#6408
    I do not think bringing back Pyro's insta-kill is a good idea. Currently there are two insta-kill classes, being Assassin and Archer. Both of which are usually used and function best as being defensive classes. I agree that insta-kills are good for the game, buffed heavies and Chemists are difficult to defeat using strictly PvP, making classes such as Assassin and Archer necessary. However, adding a third insta-kill class on the defensive side, in my eyes, would make the game more defensive biased than it already is.

    This is actually a mechanic about elf that I like. It encourages teamwork, and from my experiences, teamwork is usually at a minimum. There are rarely competitive team matches (official team vs. official team) which is where synergy between players is most prevalent. Currently, PPMs are the most popular way to mimic competitive matches, and considering you are put with a new, random group of players each match, it is hard to develop a sense of teamwork with certain players. Because elf (specifically the water element) can be used as a support class (watering flag, winding enemies away from the flag carrier, shielding teammates from arrows), it encourages teamwork which, currently, is not present in most PPMs. I am in favor of keeping any mechanic in the game that promotes working as a team rather than as individual players.

    Elf is a squishy class as is. One or two ninjas almost always defeat an Elf (in addition to other classes). Elf does not always get in a position where they can use their water element, and some maps are not designed well for Elf's water element.

    Lastly, even when the top tier elves play offense (@915, @Northernlreland, @rayquaza611), the water element has never stuck out as something so overpowered that it is in the need of a nerf.

    With this being said, I think the water element is the perfect counter to Pyro's frenzy.

    I am not 100% certain what you mean here, correct me if I am wrong.

    I believe that you are suggesting that, similar how you want Pyro's frenzy to negate the water element, you want the flint and steel to do so also? I personally would not mind this considering it would take a lot of skill in order to place the fire (via flint and steel) accurately in front of the flag carrier. I like things throughout all the classes that encourage the need to practice and develop your skills within each area of the class. Rewarding Pyro users for being accurate with their fire placements would provide an incentive to use the flint and steel more often. I'm all for it.
     
    • Like Like x 6
    #3 Foodcourt, Sep 12, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2019
  4. Ringwrather

    Ringwrather Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2016
    Messages:
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    +21
    lol no this is what i want i am not here to have you say sounds good i want to hear if its a good idea and your thoughts

    Thank you for the feedback
     
    #4 Ringwrather, Sep 12, 2019
  5. Northernlreland

    Northernlreland Well-Known Member

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    Well, water element is suppose to be used to counter pyro. Elf has to fully charge their bow to shoot the water in the first place, so indivuals such as roaming ninjas, medic D, pyro's arrows, soldiers etc should be dealing extreme amounts of damage to elf whenever the elf is trying to use water. Secondly, any decent pyro should learn discipline of when to use their frenzy or not. The pyro can easily just wait until the elf is out of the water radius and then frenzy. I really don't see a problem at all, as pyro is one of the main classes that kill elf the easiest.
     
    #5 Northernlreland, Sep 15, 2019
  6. Mnkynoodles

    Mnkynoodles ur mother

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2019
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    193
    Ratings:
    +38
    hey go away ur banned LLL

    jk

    but ye^
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
    #6 Mnkynoodles, Sep 15, 2019
  7. Islendingur

    Islendingur Bunny

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2017
    Messages:
    76
    Ratings:
    +45
    Discord:
    Islendingur#0063
    To give my opinion on nr1: I dont think we should change pyro to counter the few "op players". The change would make it harder for the normal player to play elf.

    There are always some overpowered players out there, but they worked hard for it. Dont change an entire class for just three people.
     
    #7 Islendingur, Sep 16, 2019
  8. Mnkynoodles

    Mnkynoodles ur mother

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    Agreed, as much as I dislike balancing towards casuals, I think it is a better idea to balance towards casuals in this case because there are less people who play this game than other games. From personal experience, it is better to balance a game towards the "pros" rather than casuals, as making the game too easy will just make everyone on the competitive side riot in a way. (Examples include overwatch about 1.5 years ago and fortnite as of recently)
     
    • Creative Creative x 2
    #8 Mnkynoodles, Sep 16, 2019
  9. Cardonation

    Cardonation CTF JMOD | CMS Leader

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2015
    Messages:
    576
    Ratings:
    +366
    I do not feel these changes are necessary. Elf is supposed to be a counter to Pyro, a class that is very strong and capable of killing an Elf despite its abilities if they play their cards better than the Elf does. Instant kill on a core defense class like Pyro will instantly slow the game down by a significant amount, which is the opposite of the direction we want to go with CTF (a fast-paced game). Pyro is strong in the right hands, as is Elf, so leaving it there seems like a good idea to me (despite natural counters, Pyro can still outwit an Elf to kill it, meaning it isn't a complete wash).

    Also worth pointing out, Elf takes 1 full heart of damage for each fire tick (instead of 0.5), which feels like enough for Pyro in terms of a natural counter (possibly forcing them to use Water early if they are ignited).
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    #9 Cardonation, Sep 18, 2019
  10. Northernlreland

    Northernlreland Well-Known Member

    Joined:
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    hey go away, you're not half the player I was :weary: LLL

    jk

    but ye^
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    #10 Northernlreland, Sep 20, 2019
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