1. Welcome to the Brawl website! Feel free to look around our forums. Join our growing community by typing /register in-game!

Rework Sponges, they are lame af.

Discussion in 'Capture the Flag' started by Billhelm, Feb 29, 2020.

Thread Status:
Please be aware that this thread is more than 30 days old. Do not post unless the topic can still be discussed. Read more...
  1. Billhelm

    Billhelm Active Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    34
    Ratings:
    +71
    Hey,
    thought it's time for my annual forum post. q:^)

    Looking at some of the maps that have been added recently, some map creators seem to underestimate how much influence sponges have on the gameplay. In my opinion lots of sponges shoot you way too far and/or are put in poor spots. Why would you build a gigantic map when there's sponges that allow you to skip like 50% of it? Just build a small one then lol. Why would you put a sponge somewhere on a tower that is best accessable for soldier and ninja, classes that already have great mobility?

    Don't get me wrong... not all sponges are terrible and I mainly talk about sponges that shoot you half across the map. Sponges that give u vertical height to reach a highground faster a kiiind of fine to me (still busted for ninja pearling).

    But yea. To me the only two things that most sponges currently accomplish are:
    1. making mobile classes even more mobile
    2. "fixing" maps that are way too big

    So aside from rethinking some currently present sponge placements, I suggest adding team belonging sponges, that usually can be found on your teams side of the map and can only be used by your team.
    You could make them identifiable by red/blue particles around them or a coloured name tag.

    This should buff recovery play in general and give players that are not on Ninja or Assassin better odds to catch up on a flag carrier. The reason why you usually have Ninjas and Assassins chasing you down is because these are the only ones that can catch up on you. With teambased sponges a Heavy/Necro/Pyro could shoot themselves after a chemist and try to force at least one more fight, instead of just running after them never catching up. Another thing that I think should be considered is disabling ninja-pearling during a sponge launch to bring it's mobility more in line with that of the other classes.

    So yea summarized:
    - Please put more thought in sponge placement or simply go without them.
    - Consider adding teambased sponges.
    - If teambased sponges get added, consider disabling ninja pearling when using a sponge.


    Note: I'm aware that the past changes to flag pickup delay was an attempt to buff offense play... and what I'm proposing certainly does not. But the problem of having heavily defended flagrooms you can't get out of is an entirely different story, than what's going on once the flag carrier got out. I feel like CTF should be balanced in a way where it easier to get out the flagroom but harder to make it back to your teams side, because chasing a flag carrier down and getting that sweet recov is a lot more fun than having them already dead inside the flagroom. (at least for me, lol.)

    Thanks for reading.
    - Billy
     
    • Like Like x 5
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Informative Informative x 1
    #1 Billhelm, Feb 29, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 29, 2020
  2. scapezar

    scapezar Ex-Ban/Appeal Manager | Ex-Hack Test Manager

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    668
    Ratings:
    +453
    Discord:
    Jul13n#9311
    maybe even a class that can build a temporary sponge for the team (flag-carriers not included) #OGengineer

    I do agree with these massively large maps... just make them smaller, although a complete lack of sponges would be a greater problem
     
  3. Ringwrather

    Ringwrather Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2016
    Messages:
    35
    Ratings:
    +21
    I agree that some maps are too big and would like have sponges more custom (choose about how far each song can launch with a sign on it and you could write in it something like this [v:10] (vertical:distance) [h:NE:10] (horizontal:direction:distance) I am not sure tho on team based sponges as it would be cool but how would you know what sponge works for what team as they all look the same, you would have to make them a new block then. It could also make def or off to op depending on how you use them. sign.png
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. Billhelm

    Billhelm Active Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    34
    Ratings:
    +71


    2020-03-04_17.05.57.png

    Just to give an example.
    You don't have to call it Jumppad obviously. You can also alternate the particles. I used dripping lava and water there.
    You could also add a chat message advising people that are to trying to use an enemy team's sponge.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. obikenobi21

    obikenobi21 Delta Force Jedi

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    571
    Ratings:
    +288
    I like vertical sponges in general, I think they add a lot to play around (although I think that whole sponge delay should be brought back to avoid infinite jumping on a sponge). The sponges I hate the most are sponges behind a flagroom that shoot in front of the flagroom. I think sponges like this are just terrible. If you are a defender in front of the flagroom and somebody steals, you're stuck. If you directly go after them, there's a pretty high chance they take the sponge and shoot past you. If you stay you're really just doing nothing and hoping they take the sponge. A lot of these sponges are meant for people coming from spawn to get to the middle of the map faster, but when spawn is behind the flagroom flag carriers just take them instead.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. wintergreen3

    wintergreen3 Delta Force Leader | Staff Manager | CTF Admin

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    1,259
    Ratings:
    +1,167
    I really like this idea. We all talk about new classes, or reworks, but this sort of change would be very interesting. I forgot that there used to be a delay on sponges lol, but it could be good to add it back.
    I completely agree with what @obikenobi21 said, your "own" sponges can tend to work against you a lot. It's pretty disappointing to see a flag carrier zoom halfway across the map and there is no way classes other than Ninja or Scout can do anything about it (and Scout is somewhat situational).
    I'll see what the rest of the CIC thinks about both ideas soonTM!
     
    #6 wintergreen3, Mar 5, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2020
  7. _Pai

    _Pai Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2015
    Messages:
    155
    Ratings:
    +112
    I think the idea of custom sponges are the best idea because then each map can use them in the best way possible for that map and not have to worry about over or undershooting sponges.

    However, I'm not sure of the purpose of team specific sponges. If you put them in the field of play they sound pretty hard to balance, because one team would have a significant movement advantage and movement is very important in CTF. If you use them in front of spawn, for example making the sponge in front of spawn on American Fort team specific so only that team's offense can use it, it might work, but even then I don't see a reason why it would have to be team specific. The other team would already be taking a huge risk even going over there that would probably negate the benefit of the sponge anyway. If it's not a huge risk then it's likely that spawn is way too close to the flagroom, a map design flaw that is already undesirable for other reasons.
     
    #7 _Pai, Mar 5, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2020
  8. Billhelm

    Billhelm Active Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    34
    Ratings:
    +71
    No no I wouldn't want them to be on the midfield. Basically sponges that are close to the spawn or flagroom and shoot your towards map center should imo be team specific. Sponges like on Canadian Fort or Platforms (if these maps are still in rotation lol).
    Or in other words all sponges that are supposed to get the "home"-team faster into to action. This would nerf cheesy Soldier/Ninja pathing and give more immobile classes the ability to catch up.


    It's about giving your team on your teams side of the map a mobility advantage.
    Having something like red sponges on the blue teams side would be a no go.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    #8 Billhelm, Mar 5, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2020
Loading...
Similar Threads Forum Date
Archer Rework Suggestions / Ideas Nov 23, 2021
Dwarf Rework Release Capture the Flag Nov 14, 2021
Experimental Dwarf Rework Testing Capture the Flag Sep 5, 2021
Idea Dwarf Rework lul Capture the Flag Mar 16, 2021
Zombie Rework MC-WarZ Feb 25, 2021
Thread Status:
Please be aware that this thread is more than 30 days old. Do not post unless the topic can still be discussed. Read more...