Idea Assassin Rework

Same concept as ninja Silly Powder. When in PvP, it doesn't work; moments after leaving combat, it turns on again. Not sure what the replacement item would be (i.e. the glowstone instead of redstone for ninja). A non-throwable ender pearl?

 

firecharge?

 

Ye somethin like that could work

 

Not a fan of this one.

- It's a watered down version of Ninja, see Admiral's post
- Cooldowns make gameplay boring
- Slowness effect on the shears is frustrating in a fast paced gamemode
- Can't recover in a standoff
- Can't chase as effectively
- Vulnerable to killstealers
- Useless at capping
- Mediocre at defense
- Promotes random killing since that's the only thing it's really good at

Current Assassin is a supporting powerhouse: it can chase, recover, defend and clear flagrooms. This Assassin has no role and is underpowered across the board, with the possible exception of defense.

-1

 

Disclaimer: no one let what I'm about to say make this thread about pyro, I'm just using it as an example

Indeed, not only does instakill take less skill to use, but the less skill that's involved, the less potential fun there is in "mastering" the class. Of course, there was a good deal of skill that could be applied to the old pyro, but it didn't take much effort to kill pretty much anyone; it didn't take an expert to dominate a flag room. Even though it's been nerfed, I personally find the new pyro a lot more fun because it takes more effort to use--not because it completely overpowers every one of its opponents. And even though it was nerfed with the removal of instakill, it was greatly compensated (@Admiral_Trump taught me the concept of compensating for nerfs ^-^) by the introduction of the Frenzy Mode, which will two-shot any target (except a medic of course) even if they steak once.

I've only played assassin like four times in the years I've played CTF (looking at my stats, I've killed seven people out of the eight assassination attempts I've made... js...), so I'm can hardly speak from experience like Obi, but I think this same concept can easily apply to assassin. Instead of an all-or-nothing class which can dominate 1v1s when skill is applied, more effort and a more difficult fight is put into each kill, thus allowing more room for mastering the class and more potential fun in doing so. The removal of instakill from assassin is well compensated by the true damage and the new form of blood lust, as well as the crippling knives which, in combination with the ripoff of ninja's Teleportation S--I mean the Shadow Dash (jk lol I like the idea), can be very effective in giving the assassin the opportunity to kill a flag carrier. In my opinion, this semi-nerfed version of assassin is far better than the current version simply because it offers more stuff to do, while keeping the number of active abilities the same and remaining generally powerful.

 

I saw your response to Admiral's post. You improved it from what it was but not enough to substantially differentiate it from ninja.

The good thing about current Assassin's cooldowns is that they discourage random killing: I know from experience that waiting in midfield for a potential kill every half a minute is boring as hell. They're also item cooldowns rather than effect cooldowns, so Medics can override them. That rewards defensive and supportive gameplay, since by staying near medics they're able to make the most of their redstone.

The problem with this Assassin is that it's too good on its own to provide the player with any incentive to support their team.

Still -1 I'm afraid. I might try and make a non-instakill Assassin later but I honestly think that it's fine as it is.

 

Current Assassin's more supportive because it requires proximity to a medic to fulfill its potential. Since Medics can't keep up with Assassin, it falls on the Assassin to support the Medic in situations like defense and capping.

This I agree with. But it needs the right rework.

 

@Rhos_ So, as I see it, you're pretty much agreeing that assassin as it is, is bad, but this rework shouldn't be approved because it resembles ninja too much.

Honestly, there is no rework of assassin that does not resemble ninja in one way or another as long as you remove its instakill--which, moving toward a better CTF, would be the preferred course of action. Lethal recovery classes (mainly ninja, assassin, and archer) have two main aspects which aid them in their role: high damage output, and being able to quickly reach and damage their target in one way or another. In the case of ninja, it has a well-damaging (I wouldn't suffice to say powerful without Sharp V tbh) sword and ender pearls for extreme mobility; current assassin has instakill Assassinate and its sugars for speed; archer can reach from afar with instakill arrows which travel very fast. Of course this is between ninja and assassin here, but archer is just an outside example.

Removing the instant kill from assassin, you're left with a dude with gold boots, an iron sword, and some speed--in other words, a severely nerfed ninja. Now buff and this non-instant-kill assassin and make it something, but be sure to give it its key recovery tools of mobility and high damage. Take Obi's rework for a surprisingly convenient example: high damage in the form of true damage, and speed and short-ranged teleportation (since Speed I alone is hardly enough to effectively catch up to a target) give it its necessary recovery tools, since that's its role in the game during the times that the flag is in enemy hands.

But wait, that's exactly what ninja is in the first place. High damage, high mobility, low armor (although full leather on Obi's assassin isn't half bad), and a recovery role are all traits that both ninja and assassin have shared the whole time. Removing the instant kill from assassin and compensating with other new abilities (while not making assassin the next necro) will inevitably make it similar to ninja because at their core, ninja's and assassin's roles are already practically the same.

 

@obikenobi21 assassin not being self sufficient means it's more powerful in situations where it's being supported by a medic, and since medics are naturally found in defense that encourages the assassin to stick around and support.

@pookeythekid yeah, I get what you're saying. You've changed my mind.

 

Ye but to be fair you either have to be really good at getting combos while red stone faking or just get your work done quickly if you're to gain as much or more health than you lose.

 

I really am not sure if this has been already discussed (due to the fact that I'm too astounded by the cluster of discussion to read through), this rework creates a new form of ghost capping with the return on the eye of ender. Though this could be fixed if the flag pickup time was increased like ninja's.

I really like the idea and how it makes it a more pvp-induced class, but the one heart a hit regeneration could be seriously OP to players who are fairly experienced in hitting and strafing.

Something I didn't see in your post was the amount of time a player was given slowness and neghaste when hit by the knives, which would be nice to know.

Otherwise I would really enjoy playing a class similar to this in the future!