You Know What Really Grinds My Gears

Yeah I agree. But the thing is... He has gears and he's human?!?! Robot?!?

 

agreed, he must be a robot

 

You know what really grinds my gears? The fact that some people would have the audacity to verbally abuse the server network that saved their gamemodes. Seriously, it's time to stop with the relentless hate towards Brawl. If you are so bothered with what they are doing with CTF and feel compelled to post hateful content about them, what on earth are you still doing here? Just leave. We don't want you here. If you truly cared about CTF, you would do something about it in a helpful manner, not post hate. By posting things like this, you are only worsening the CTF community and the way that other people view it. Brawl isn't destroying CTF, certain people who have the gall to post content such as this are.

... Am I the only one bothered by these conflicting statements? :V Why even include "no offense to Brawl" in any part of this piece of work if you are going to intentionally stoop to an unprecedented level of offensiveness?

 

f

wut about
munchy mc

 

Mcpvp is never coming back. Time to move on, drag.

 

i hope you realize that we wont leave because we have friends, thats really the only reason we are still here, cause we have people to talk to. The staff of this server dont give a crap about us, the april fools joke is probably what 'frustrates' us the most. We give them a ton of server ideas that only jr. or new full mods reply to. Brandino made an amazing engineer rework, admiral did something, etc. The april fools joke upsets us the most because it shows that the staff can do as we request, they just dont give a flying fart.

 

I personally don't insult brawl half as much as many of my counterparts, but this statement really annoys me. Sure, brawl could be doing a lot worse with ctf, that much is true. I have even defended it on numerous occasions saying ctf wouldn't even be here without brawl. With that said, that doesn't mean brawl is by any means a perfect host. NOBODY is perfect in the slightest, and whilst it gets more hate than it deserves, that doesn't mean some of the points that have been raised aren't very true. I would like to point out a couple particular things in the post though:

Some of us are still on CTF for the community not the gamemode, which is fair enough. However, did it ever cross your mind that maybe we're trying to change and rework parts of the gamemode because we actually care about the game? People don't just complain for the sake of complaining; they complain because they want something done about it. They wouldn't bother raising the issue if they didn't find it important. It doesn't justify mindless insults, but when it feels like the issues raised have been ignored by people (and for many that has happened) people can get pretty angry. To have worded the post in the way you have has nothing but worsened the situation, given now you're provoking even more hatred against it. The killer words in this little extract though are "we don't want you here." This I could probably write a small thesis on, but what you've done there once again is state you don't want people here talking against brawl. What? Are you Serious? Like I said, Brawl isn't a perfect host and it needs people to complain and antagonise it in order to realise the mistakes it has made. You've gone too far the other way in defense of brawl. You need criticism to point out the mistakes being made. Unnecessary insults are unjustified, I agree, but I think it does tell you how fed up some members of the community are after being ignored.

The thing is, we have been. Take a look at the server ideas section of the ctf forums. There are enough reworks and map creations to compile a large book. Yet in spite of all of these ideas, there has been little change in the gamemode itself. You've had a rework for 1 class, minor changes to a few others, banners instead of wool (which is still probably the biggest argument in the community after all this time) and 2 new map waves, 1 which came out only 4 days ago, and other had pretty much all of it's maps removed very quickly for being awful! A few small changes yeah, but not a lot other than that list. That's really not a lot given how unbalanced the game is right now, and given the amount of effort put into these ideas, the fact that almost all of them have been ignored (they have to have been in order for there to be so many ideas for so few changes) would annoy quite a few in the community. You say we're not posting in a helpful manner, but plenty of people are! The mindless insulting in the post is bad, yeah, but it also proves a point there are problems that need to be addressed. Brawl might not be destroying ctf, but it's certainly not improving the game in the ways it needs to in order to help it. I condone those that are just insulting for the sake of insulting.

In the meantime, I'm pretty sure the tone of your post has only made things worse.

 

I completely agree with this, the amount of amazing server ideas is insane. The staff dont care about us, they do tiny reworks/stuff to satisfy us a little so we dont riot. Thats really it. The april fools joke shows that they dont care

 

that is true, quantity of server ideas don't necessarily equal good quality ideas. However I could also argue that you can take good parts of reworks and compile them to make a good one. More ideas, more chance of some good bits
There's also the possibility that they'll lose business if they don't listen to the community, as if people get angry enough, they leave. It's all very well saying they decide everything, but if they don't make good decisions, people will leave the gamemode. If they make decisions to make the game incredibly bad, then people will only have the community to stay for, which can be done on skype etc. Businesses are all about the relationship between the customer and the store owner. Sure the store owner has the right to kick anyone he/she wants off the premises and make his/her own decisions about the business, but equally he still has to sell something his/her customers want. The best businesses have a good relationship with the customer, and I have to say at the moment brawl doesn't have the best with the former mcpvp community

 

OK, you have a point there.

 

I believe @Ducksfan101 knows about a server in progress with wool ctf, the same classes/maps, so no, brawl was indeed not the last hope.

 

Yes, indeed, the one being developed by @KirbysDreamLand and @5ive_Head.

 

how does anyone not know about this yet

 

Well of course. However, if friends are the only reason people who post insulting threads like this are staying, then are threads such as this one necessary? Can they not simply have a good time talking with their friends and not insult the server network?

I understand that the joke was frustrating. However, that does not justify some of the posts I have seen, this thread included. Once again, if friends are the only reason people are staying, nobody should care about the staff or the server. Of course that's not the case, because people are bothered by these things. Once again, if something bothers a person so badly, perhaps it would be better to do something productive to fix it instead of merely complaining about it. Complaining doesn't help and is not a legitimate means of effectively bringing about change.

I agree with this. This is an enormous issue. If it's any consolation to you, this is a problem that has plagued Brawl for a long time. It's not just ideas for CTF that aren't being considered. Me and a few others have thought about solutions to this in the past. If you want to learn more about that, maybe shoot me a pm? If you see that this is an issue to, we could talk about it.

I actually don't know what you mean by this. Did they actually change back to wool in-game?

I apologize that I came off as annoying. I understand that I didn't exactly put what I posted as lightly as I could have. I hope you can forgive my slip of tact.

It's not the validity of the points that are the issue, it's the way they are presented that is the issue. Of course, the hate threads that do nothing but insult Brawl aren't valid, but threads that complain about issues can be. It's simply the fact that some of the threads come off as offensive and insulting that ruins the threads. It would be much more helpful if the threads could be written politely. Nothing will be accomplished if the people who actually run the server feel insulted.

Yes.

This is the problem right here. Instead of being productive about things and respectfully presenting ideas and things that can be changed, a lot of threads do just what you describe here: complain. Additionally, most of the CTF idea threads that I have read, especially about class changes, sound like the OP was really angry when he or she wrote it. They typically read something like this. "Pearling is utter BS and I can't defend against pearling so it should be removed." "Dwarf is SOOOO cheap and unfair. All they do is sit in the flag room and camp all day long. I'm writing this thread because I'm mad that I died to dwarf like eight times today, so it should be nerfed/changed."

Or unless they die to a class and think that it's overpowered. Now I know that this doesn't go for wool, although there have been no small amount of hatethreads provoked by that issue either. (Honestly, I have no clue why wool hasn't been re-added since everyone seems to want it back.)

I completely agree. Something seriously needs to be done to make the community at least feel as though their ideas are being considered.

Once again, I apologize for my lack of tact.

Though the way I worded it came off as rude, yes, I am serious. No, I am not saying that I don't want people on here "talking against Brawl," though it depends on what you mean by that. I would prefer if the people who blatantly insult Brawl to cease doing so and instead go about rectifying their grievances in a productive manner. Post threads by all means, just don't post threads saying, "All Brawlers suck." "All Brawl ever does is ruin things." etc. It absolutely does not need people to antagonize it for it to realise its mistakes. Rarely does good ever come from that, and when it does, it pales in comparison to the good that would have come if the issue had been addressed properly and politely.

I really haven't gone too far. I have perhaps worded my defense in an insulting manner, which I regret doing, however, I have not gone too far. Constructive criticism is necessary, not simply criticism.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who recognizes the lack of attention payed to ideas.

Don't worry, I'm not throwing all of the CTF community under a blanket. I'm sorry if my post seemed to insinuate that. I'm talking specifically about the people who post threads in an unhelpful manner.

Yes, I'm sorry about the tone of my previous post. At the very least, it has lead to a few more posts recognizing that something needs to be done about the lack of attention payed to server ideas.

 

If they're written in an unrespectful way that's something very different to wanting things changed. Like I said, some people are annoyed because of the lack of change, others are annoyed for the sake of being annoyed. In this case those writing the posts belong to the latter group would be condoned outright. Those belonging to the former group, it could be put in a more constructive manner, but equally I can understand why they might be annoyed. The lack of change can be frustrating, and whilst it doesn't justified to write in that way, I can understand their point of view

There are 2 reasons which could possibly explain why they complain rather than offer solutions to fix the problem. The first being that they legitimately don't have any idea as to how that can be done, they just want it to be better. The second is that they already have raised solutions and they have been ignored in the rather large and growing server ideas section. I don't totally disapprove of all of the complain threads, it's a good record of how the community feel at the time, and tells the staff the most pressing issue through the volume of threads created. However, mindless insults throughout these threads can be rather tiresome, and moreover unnecessary. Again, I can understand the point of view people can come from (not that I approve of it) as it can get frustrating when little changes and people are ignored. The best method is still by far being cooperative and working on a good compromise, as that will by far get a lot more done than constantly complaining about it

Firstly to answer the question you asked @TheSkullOfNight , no, they're still banners. Secondly, if people die to a class they think is overpowered, yes they might go and write a rework thread, or a complaint thread. Usually it does take more than one single incident for that to happen. I know if I died once to an archer headshot that wouldn't sway me anywhere near enough to write a hate filled post on it. As i said before, the number of these threads appearing usually means that something strange is going on from a gameplay perspective, otherwise so many different points of view wouldn't be agreeing something is a problem. Again, that doesn't give people the right to be mindlessly aggressive and insulting, which is where the line must be drawn.

That's where the staff need to come in. If so many people are agreeing something is an issue, clearly the staff need to take steps to make sure this is fixed. We wouldn't need to raise the issue otherwise!

Yeah, I know what you meant from the start, but I decided to word it ambiguously just as you had worded yours. People could interpret your post as "brawl players don't want mcpvp players here" which is what I wanted to be clear. The way it was written coupled with the tone gave that impression, and certainly wouldn't improve matters in the current state of things. I wouldn't go as far as to completely shun people whom are hating, but I would definitely strong disapprove of the behaviour. Mindless aggression gets everyone nowhere, and in fact hinders the speed of change given the complaints mean that people are less likely to think in a cooperative way and come up with a genuine compromise to suit everyone

Constructive criticism is needed, criticism is pointless unless done in the right way. Some people genuinely don't have a way to improve the situation, but as long as it's worded without insulting anyone, their opinion should still be taken into account

Needs to happen for a compromise to be made

Again, ambiguity comes into play here. The aggressive tone of the post combined with the way it was phrased, it could be easily mistaken for that. I know that's what you meant, but people can easily take it the other way

I hope it does. As much as insulting doesn't do any good, neither does the lack of change

 

People like you say this:

>Brawl is stupid, I hate brawl and everything associated with it is dumb and stupid!!!

And the same people say this:

>Omg why is CTF turning so bad why won't Brawl update us???

 

aha yes complaining
wool aha yes i agree
!

 

waaayyyyyy tooo long to read