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Why I gave up on CTF

Discussion in 'Capture the Flag' started by XplosionReturns, Aug 9, 2015.

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  1. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Valid point about the banners, but the removal of the helmet is still annoying. I get that it's cosmetic change, but it's quite ugly IMO. Nobody flipped when pyro got red armor. Nobody flips over how the maps look. I mean, It doesn't affect gameplay but that doesn't stop it from being derpy.
    Now about staff-
    Nom is a coder and an Admin, sure. But I was addressing others who aren't as familiar.
    and when I say we want updates- We want productive and agreed upon updates to the game, such as a pyro-chemist-soldier nerf or the addition of a free recovery class (scout), not out of the blue updates that really seem thrown together. McPvP wasn't the best at updates, but they didn't blindside us with them either. It was pretty well known that engineer and ninja were getting changed before it happened, and even more well known that Elf was being added. Also, the community had final say on Elf. If there was huge backlash, it wouldn't be added (we all know what happened to Paladin).
     
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    #21 Sir_Inge, Aug 13, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2015
  2. Magnificent

    Magnificent Dallas Fuel

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    lmfao this entire thread makes me laugh
     
  3. HaHaGetLost

    HaHaGetLost I hope one day you choke on the s*** you talk.

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    I agree 100% on this
     
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    #23 HaHaGetLost, Aug 13, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 23, 2018
  4. MineBrick12

    MineBrick12 Active Member

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    yes
     
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  5. XplosionReturns

    XplosionReturns PRO was the best rank so fite me

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    @PumpkinTerrorist
    I farmed on my laptop back when I had 5 fps.

    @Xelasi
    I only quit 2 before and that was due to these problems:
    Time #1: My house changed to Xfinity, and with Netflix, 3 PCs, and 7 phones it was a pain in the ass to play. I came back after I got my own network.
    Time #2: I wanted to play Evolve because it was a "more updated" version of CTF. While it has it's own flaws, I loved it. However, it was a resource intensive game and I only got 5 fps on it with my laptop.

    As for if MCPVP completely died, it did in a way. I'm not just living in nostalgia. Since the transfer, nothing performance has improved. I still get connection issues on CTF, whereas other servers and on Evolve, I don't.

    It's a matter of finding the updates. You'd think that Brawl would post them in update logs, but it seems like THEY don't even want to accept CTF as a new Brawl game. IMO, they keep it updated with other games, but why is CTF the exception? https://www.brawl.com/forums/65/

    That was only a point. I could give a **** about BBH. People knew and hated him. And I don't know anyone outside of CTF other than a few build mods with spot-on logic and reasoning.

    I get data movement and transfer. Not all companies label their data or store it the same way. But theres "soon" and an eta. But having stats on here feels different from it being on MCPVP.

    I get the map limit, but frankly more maps isn't a reason to donate for me, since I have no return investment. As for the rank, unlikely that I'll get it.

    I understand how you feel (since this post blew up) and I do have a problem communicating my thoughts. Then, on top of that is my short term memory loss where I forget why I posted this. My intent wasn't to rant, but explain myself.

    @Admiral_Munson
    If you want to spread religion, please go to christian mingle.

    @MrWaffleman
    It's not the quantity of updates, it's the quality of the updates. I don't have a problem with Nom either. IF you actually read my post you would have saw that I did notice it's easier to dictate a coder, but it's hard not to when they keep it on the hush-hush. There is no hype when an update doesn't have an eta or any leaks.

    @ReubenS
    This is my last post. I'm done worrying about what happens to ctf, mainly because I don't care anymore. If you though this was a quitting post, re-read the post because you've missed the point then.

    @AdamLovesBarca
    I don't look at it like I'm leaving. Evolve isn't far from CTF. TBH, they just released tier 5 Trapper and the tier 5 assault came a month before. I have yet to see anything added to CTF that is class related. And before Evolve releases a class, they test it making the game different, yet not unbalanced like CTF is.

    @Sir_Inge
    While I don't stalk the Evolve forums, they run into the same ordeal. People give ideas, they look at the ideas, but don't add the ideas. IF they did, then people would brag about how it was their idea, taking lawsuits, but that is on a whole new tier of a game. There is 0 reason for Brawl or even MCPVP to disban people's ideas.
    1. But I heard they added the anti-hack. How's that turn out(it was a joke, however many months for a simple anti-hack)?
    2. Like I said, "soon" and an eta are different Evolve AT LEAST gives an ETA on updates. Jack(new class) was said to be released on the 12. IT was.
    3. Banners was an example of de jure and de facto. While it was good in theory, it was horriple in practice. Assassin was useless when I played as it because you'd have to wait for the flag to land. Well, after using assassinate you were vulnerable.

    Evolve is the perfect example of an a-symmetrical game, while it is all balanced out. They tested the game for 4+ months before releasing it. A++ for them.

    @iAMBridgeDweller
    HAHAHAHAHA wow. I have been waiting since 2012 to get any sort of major update that creates someting that adds onto the game, not takes it away like the banner for the flag. This was a reason why I left in the first place. **** doesn't look like it's being done, when that hypotheses is proved wrong and an update is turned over, it's half-assed and/or unnecessary.

    @wintergreen3 and I'm happy that people will stay on CTF. It was a great community and like every community, it has bumps like the Paladin issue. Evolve is CTF on a higher-skilled level. If you love ranged combat then you'd like Evolve. Everyone has a role, and that affects the outcome of the game. Then they keep it updated and add new classes. Recently they released tier 5 trapper. CTF was my base, now Evolve is my skyscraper.

    @Lord_Roke
    WHAT?!?!? You held a poll for removing instakills? Now that is by far the only time something of that magnitude was held.

    As for ETAs, Evolve does it just fine. Matter of fact, it comes down to leveling the class, aka, weaken and strengthen it's areas. It's like how Assassin was edited to have 2 sugar and 1 redstone. I forgot if they added another redstone or not during the transfer.

    "the removed helmet just makes it a bit more challenging to capture a flag, it is not a game breaking problem." WHAT v2?!?!?!?!? When you are leaving the flagroom and you are outnumbered, you mean to tell me that it's not a problem? Or even that ninjas do more damage to these classes, making it's recover rate even higher?
     
  6. MineBrick12

    MineBrick12 Active Member

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    #26 MineBrick12, Aug 13, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2015
  7. Lord_Roke

    Lord_Roke Forever the Forums Watchdog
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    When you leave the flag room and are outnumbered, you would be dead with and without a helmet anyway.
     
  8. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Not really. Let's say I'm heavy and a ninja sneaks up on me. That 1 armor point could make the difference between killing the ninja with 1 1/2 hearts left and dying. You take a TON of damage leaving the flag room, so every heart that you can conserve counts. That's why getting healed is so valuable.

    Also, this is a part of what I'm talking about- Mods not understanding the game. Roke, no offense, but that comment makes me thing you don't really grasp the mechanics of CTF. I've left the flag room outnumber 10:1 as chemist, medic, etc. and survived because I was able to tank the hits landed on me (sometimes by really close margins like 1.5-1 hearts) and then slowly kill off the recoverers. The only reason CTF even works is because you can get out of a crowded flagroom with little to no suppourt about 10% of the time.

    Once pyro is nerfed, this helmet change is going to become a lot more meaningful because ninja will become even more powerful recovering force, and Ninja deals non-true damage.
     
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  9. Cher_

    Cher_ Active Member

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    This is CTF we're talking about. Cappers can easily be outnumbered and live to tell about it.
     
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  10. Lord_Roke

    Lord_Roke Forever the Forums Watchdog
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    I never claimed that have I have detailed knowledge about CTF, but I still don't see how this one armor point makes a gamebreaking difference. Until the banners were invented you would survive in these rare situations you mentioned, now you would die in them. This means nothing but that capturing the flag is a bit more hard. So instead of the 10% you mentioned, it might only be 9% now, this still doesn't break the game, it only changes it.

    They can still do that with one armor point less, it is just a bit less likely to happen.
     
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    #30 Lord_Roke, Aug 14, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2015
  11. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Defense is easier than offense, meaning capping should be (in theory) more easy than defending.
     
  12. Lord_Roke

    Lord_Roke Forever the Forums Watchdog
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    There is no way to measure how hard or easy one was before the change and is now.
    My point is, that you are used to the 10% mentioned above. Now it has changed to 9%, which is not a huge difference, but still a difference you just need to get used to. This makes defending a bit easier, capping a bit harder, but in the end it is just a small difference.
    You think this makes capping too hard, others might think capping was too easy before.
     
  13. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    Umm, I've generally heard form most players that defense is easier than offense. Just sayin'. I'd like to take a poll though cause I'm not 100% though.
     
  14. Creaturelord

    Creaturelord Active Member

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    ok nobody cares gtfo lmao
     
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  15. GreenNature

    GreenNature Nature is Creative

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    I still like CTF.
     
  16. XplosionReturns

    XplosionReturns PRO was the best rank so fite me

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    @Lord_Roke @Sir_Inge

    To settle this debacle, here is a snip-it of a page about armor:

    [​IMG]

    "The player's current protection level is represented visually by the armor bar. Each defense point (1 ([​IMG])) represent 4% damage reduction. With all 20 shown full, the player has a total of 80% damage reduction. The armor meter is affected by the particular pieces that are worn, as well as the tier of the armor. Different combinations of armor provide different levels of defense.

    The following table shows the amount of defense points added by each individual piece of armor, as well as the total points added by a full set of armor for each material."

    Now using simple math, a diamond helmet is 3 points (1.5 bars). Since the reduction rate is 4%, you are giving up a total of 12% (3*4) just to have a cosmetic change. And that is just for heavy alone. Leather is weaker making it non as important as Diamond, but when they have a heavy-hitting defense with a hellava damage output, when you pick up that flag you are giving up 12% of your damage reduction. As said above, 80% (all 20 filled) is the max at non-enchant level. Leaving you with 68% damage reduction. That is the difference between life and death. With Ninja already being a heavy hitter, you take more damage from them. The least damaged classes would be Pyro and Chemist (leather caps) but you are still giving up 4% reduction. If you want to carry this discussion out any longer, if you have a job, start asking for 4%-12% less than what you already make.
     
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  17. ReubenS

    ReubenS Well-Known Member

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    have you noticed that you're wasting hours ranting about a piece of pixelated wool on a stick that goes ontop of a 8x8 head from a game you've quite 3+ times
     
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  18. BAWSS5

    BAWSS5 Well-Known Member

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    Has anyone noticed that they're wasting hours trying to get that piece of pixelated wool on a stick back to their own pixelated wool on a stick so that they can then try to get another wool on a stick that is actually the same wool on a stick?

    In fact, has anyone noticed that you waste hours of your life on a forum dedicated to arguing about how to better get that wool on a stick?
     
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  19. Lord_Roke

    Lord_Roke Forever the Forums Watchdog
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    So the removal of a helmet reduces the armor protection by 4% to 12% with an average of 8%. Since a full armor is 80%, this means a tenth of the armor is removed by average. As discussed above, this would reduce a chance of 10% to escape the flag room to a chance of 9%. Still not much of a difference.

    Your comparison to your job salary isn't fully accurate: In terms of the example, the change didn't lower the salary for a single employee, but for everyone with a job, as it lowered the chance to escape the flag room for everyone playing CTF.
    If everyone gets less money, it isn't a bad thing anymore because prizes will also decrease. It is similar on CTF: It might be more complicated for you to escape the enemy flag room, but it is also easier to for you to kill players from the enemy team trying to capture the flag.
     
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  20. Sir_Inge

    Sir_Inge Well-Known Member

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    There's one problem with that logic and it can be seen in McWar- when you make it too easy to defend, nobody tries to capture and they all randomkill because what's the point in trying?
     
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